Sunday Morning Brunch Log

26April2009

AfriGeneas Meeting Center

 

Evanco : Wonder what happened to ancestry.com's federal census on the 1850/1860 slave schedules. Cannot seem to get into it at all.

 

alt : morning khathu...how goes it?

 

khathu : morning alt things are going well

 

alt : home for awhile?

 

khathu : i started on my article for the Avoyelles parish genealogical society

Home until july

 

alt : wonderful!!!!!!!!!

 

khathu : so i can focus on my genealogy a little bit more

 

alt : morning afrivee

 

AfriVee : Howdy ALT and all

How yall be 2 day ALT and Khathu

 

khathu : Good morning AfriVee. i'm well

 

AfriVee : very very good

So do the two of you watermark the photos you put on line

 

alt : I haven't used the watermark feature AfriVee

 

AfriVee : Ran across an application while browsing that does just that. I had not thught of it previously

 

alt : have to read upon it...I don't think I have any photos that I would consider proprietary

 

AfriVee : With all the sophisticated tools out here I suppose it would be easy to un watermark it if a person was determined to use works of others. Well it is worth giving a thought.

 

alt : when I write my book LOL I will look into copyright & proprietary aspects of photos LOL

 

AfriVee : MichaelHall was here last night He teaches Black research for a fee

 

alt : where is Michael located?

 

AfriVee : Has a site on line with first class and has 2 students

 

alt : good morning vicky

 

vicky : Hall or Hait afrivee?

 

khathu : vicky - i just wanted to let you know that i started working on my article for the genealogical society in LA u all talked him up

 

vicky : hello michaelhait

 

AfriVee : I wished him well and told him that in general Afri's do not pay to play genealogy. Howdy Michael I was just talking about you lol howdy

 

vicky : I wish I could talk up Mariah afrivee lol

 

michaelhait : No wonder my nose was itching lol

Good morning everyone!

 

AfriVee : Oops except I called you Hall or at least my non spelling keyboard did and this is a spanking brand new keyboard.

 

michaelhait : That's alright - it won't be the worst thing I was ever called :)

 

alt : michaelhait, I think afrivee is right.....AA's are going to exhaust all avenues for FREE help before they part with money for genealogy research.... having said that I wish you well in your venture.

 

michaelhait : I think that is true for most people - not exclusively AAs... especially in this economy. FYI - I am also the site administrator for the Prince George's, Charles, and St. Mary's cos., Maryland, Genealogy Trails sites. We offer free record transcriptions online, similar to USGenWeb. You can take a look if you want at http://www.genealogytrails.com - this is the main site. Strictly not-for-profit

 

alt : wonderful michaelhait

 

AfriVee : I too wish you well. I ‘spose most people come with where they want to go and will not be deterred from the preconceptions, facts and the need to document not withstanding. Thanx for that link michaelhait

 

alt : I have it bookmarked michaelhait ..thanks

Hello Selma.....How was church? LOL

 

AfriVee : Church be in her heart lol

 

michaelhait : Sure - I was surprised when I first came across the site (never knew it existed), then saw that there were no administrators for any of the Md sites (where I conduct most of my research).

 

Selma : Good morning/afternoon to you all...

 

alt : Selma, my "bedside" service was all I could handle this AM

 

Selma : Alt.. you see my girl Annette Gordan Reed got the Pulitzer..remember I said that when the book came out..that she would deserve it... LOL

 

alt : looks like all of the Ohio counties that I research are in need of "adoption" michaelhait

 

Selma : So did the man who wrote. Slavery by another name From the Civil war to WWII saw him on book TV yesterday...think I have to read that too.

 

alt : yep, you called that one Selma, have you finished the book yet?

 

AfriVee : We spent a lil bit of time talking about the new search engine at Ancestry last nite... Have y’all given it a good try or do you start with the old one

 

michaelhait : Selma Haven't read the book yet, but the research she conducted that was pubd in the NGSQ a few yrs ago was great! I have the book on order at Amazon

 

Selma : Yes. but I have to reread the last parts again. The male author whose name escapes me did a lot of research in GA and Alabama

 

alt : Ancestry & the New Search......I don't like it... much ado about nuttin IMHO LOL LOL

 

michaelhait : alt Take a look at the adoption page - there is a very good support group/mailing list for hosts - though some of the folks are a little chatty

 

alt : will do michaelhait

 

Selma : He also did alot of genealogical research in those areas reconstructing those families..it was interesting.. It is suppose to go up to the high 80's and 90's today here in VA what happened to spring

 

alt : it sprung Selma LOL LOL

 

Selma : I might have to put air on

 

michaelhait : They were talking about the Gordon-Reed book on the Assoc of Pro Geneal. mailing list last wk & someone pointed out the Eric Foder[?] gave the book a bad review. That surprised me - I truly enjoyed his books on the Reconstruction

 

alt : Eric Froner from Columbia Univ....

 

michaelhait : I read the review in the NYT - he really dismissed the book, though he did mention the thoroughness of the research

 

Selma : Will have to look for his review. Some folks here in VA were foaming at the mouth and had a lot to say which I found interesting since if appeared that none of them had read the book

 

alt : I think his review was an "academic" thing.... who does she think she is....a lawyer pretending to be a researcher type of attitude.

 

Selma : The Preserve Jefferson Group here (that’s not their name)...is coming out with a book this summer..

 

michaelhait : I remember reading somewhere (now where I can't remember) that the Jefferson scholars in Va were all up in arms over the whole Hemings connection

 

Selma : "Some" of the Jeffersnon Scholars...they are the ones writing the book

 

khathu : i read the book and wished she had focused more on the other Hemmings sibling

 

alt : of course they were....a well researched aspect they never even bothered to think of in the "scholarship"

 

michaelhait : Seems to me you can't dismiss the DNA evidence – that’s hard science, not speculation

 

Selma, Gordon-Reeds family grew up in the house on the next street in back of my cousin in Conroe Texas... The brother still lives there

 

Selma : She is a Texan ...you go girl

 

khathu : What was Eric Foner criticism of the book

 

Selma : They grow um bold in Texas

 

michaelhait : There was quite a bit of criticism khathu - let me see if I can find the link for the review

 

alt : I research FPOC & the UGRR here in Ohio....recently have been to two (2) workshops presented by Genealogy societies on anti-slavery & abolitionist... They completely ignored the role played by FPOC & the Black Churches in the UGRR movement...rarely mention the role of AA's in the UGRR movement

 

michaelhait : http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/05/books/review/Foner-t.html?_r=1

How can you ignore their involvement?

 

Selma : Trust me its easy.. LOL

Its done all the time..

 

michaelhait : Easy but not accurate, I guess.

 

Selma : There was a conference here in the UGRR in Norfolk at NSU...unfortunately it was the same day as our seminar. Apparently there is a film about the UGRR in this Tidewater area..gonna see if I can get.

 

khathu : Some of his critique is very valid

I discussed the book with my aunt and we discussed some of the same point that Prof. Foner mentioned . The Hemmsings of Monticello

 

2009-04-26 12:15:05 michaelhait : Haven't read the book yet khathu but some of the criticism was over style ( maybe valid) and some seemed to imply that he did not accept the conclusions

 

khathu : She does make a lot of assumptions

 

AfriVee : I think it is just great to have the documented body of work

 

Khathu : but it is all based on interpretation of the documents

and the perspective and worldview of the individuals interpreting the documents

i believe the review is decent

 

michaelhait : That is true for all history & genealogy

 

Selma : Documentation has to be limited because there are no documents for the Hemmings which they generate..

 

alt : I would think with so "little" actually written/documented about the life-style of that period for the Hemmingses that "imagination" would have to play a part in a cohesive story.

 

khathu : Selma - I completely understand that

 

Selma : I think the review is decent too....I don't think there was some long lasting romance.

 

michaelhait : alt There will sometimes be limited records, but imagination plays no part in the historical process - you can suggest conclusions based only on evidence

sometimes = most of the time. But in a book for popular consumption imagination can be used - i.e. Roots, just cant pass it off as fact

 

alt : don't the "Lincoln" authors, including Foner play with the "facts'?

 

khathu : therein lying the issue imagination vs. conclusions. these can both be subjective based on who is doing the interpretation

 

AfriVee : I would say we all do that including authors

 

michaelhait : true - it is the extent to which imagination creates facts that the records do not support. I am not talking specifically about AG-R, just popular history in general

 

Selma : Heck I would submit the histories of this country have been imaginative. for the last 200 years at least from my reading of primary sources. You would almost think we were not HERE..or some shadow barely acknowledged.

 

michaelhait : Selma There is a good book on that subject, that looks at how different textbooks throughout the last 200 yrs have treated historical subjects based on the politics of the time

 

alt : Gordon-Reed has her genealogical facts "squared away" and the social mores of the period in tact.....based on those "facts" where is she going wrong?

 

khathu : It is a good book but it is not above criticism

 

Selma : Oh I agree no book is

 

vicky : no book is

 

alt : agree on that Khathu

 

AfriVee : Does the interpretation of yesteryear happenings in the setting of the present require/demand creative imagination? Writers spend two or more years with the subject and actually find themselves enveloped and engulfed in what it was like yesteryear

 

Selma : Well it requires that we not read in present day to the past for sure..like half the folks looking for Birth certificates done in 1830's with names of parents date, age and weight

 

michaelhait : AfriVee This goes back to the definition of interpretation/analysis & the duty of historians. Is the job to analyze the facts to gain insight or to ask "what does it mean"?

 

AfriVee : That is one of the tools derived in the community research in genealogy that I find

 

alt : if you ever read Alan Eckhart and his writings on the "Frontiersmen" & the Indians of the Midwest, all best sellers in that niche and considered to be "factual" you can see how liberties are taken in portraying the "facts"

 

Selma : So the fact that prior to Reed most historians put the Hemmings story in the foot notes or not at all....means that it meant nothing.

 

khathu : but clearly one's world view and life's experience are going to impact one's interpretation of the documents or facts

 

michaelhait : I didn't word that last statement well - I hope the meaning was understood

 

Khathu : Unfortunately social science research is not an objective endeavor contrary to popular belief

 

michaelhait : khathu That's part of the problem - you have to analyze the facts without bias. Most historians have not done this

 

khathu : that is impossible to do

 

AfriVee : michaelhait It depends to a large extent on who is doing the research and their approach/thesis

 

alt : an example of Echart's work/research.... he had the Shawnee Chief BlueJacket as a white man captured by the shawnee and made a chief.... recent DNA testing blew that out of the water.

 

khathu : one's experience is going to impact the interpretation - one has to be as objective as possible but keeping in mind that subjectivity is going to impact our endeavor to some extent

 

alt : his theory on BlueJacket was even made into a money moaking summer production in this are titled BlueJacket.. it is now closed and being re-written reflecting BlueJacket's true heritage

 

michaelhait : Responsible history (& genealogy, to bring it all around :) ) does not form a thesis first, & find evidence to support it - it looks at the evidence and forms a conclusion based on facts

 

AfriVee : Howdy 3rd

 

michaelhait : I think it is possible to form a conclusion based on facts alone

 

khathu : I am a trained historian and I understand your point

 

Selma : and what pray tell is Blue Jacket's true heritage alt.

 

3rdTHawkins : hey afri all khathu michael selma and vicky

 

khathu : No research is completely free from bias or subjectivity

 

Selma : Agreed..

 

khathu : that is the point i am making

 

michaelhait : khathu difference of opinion that can be debated forever... and has been

 

AfriVee : A story is never the whole story

 

khathu : This debate has been going on for years - The Myth of Objectivity

 

michaelhait : personally, I can see both sides, and both sides are valid - I believe that you can remove 99.99% of subjectivity from research if determined to do so - but don't really want to continue the debate here

 

khathu : It has been my experience that the social science researchers who acknowledge the issue of subjectivity and their commitment to still conduct an objective as much as possible have been more successful in their research

 

michaelhait : khathu Agree with that - you have to want to be objective to be objective. The Genealogical Proof Standard provides steps to be more objective in genealogical research

 

alt : http://www.bioforensics.com/news/bluejacket_4-06-4.html

for Selma ..blueJacket & DNA

 

AfriVee : michaelhait not to the person seeking to prove what I call "high cheek bone ancestry" lol

 

michaelhait : lol Well those society-members (and prospective ones) can be a trip sometimes...

 

khathu : For example, a woman conducting research on the enslaved African woman experience may bring a different insight into the study than a man

 

alt : GPF is ever-changing didn't they recently change their "preponderence of evidence" position as it apllies to genealogy?

 

khathu : this is not to say that her insight will be more valid than a man she will just be bring a different worldview to the study

 

michaelhait : "preponderance of evidence" was never part of the GPS - that was pre-GPS

 

AfriVee : Yes, I think preponderance was eliminated as being legal language

 

Selma : DNA evidence does add to the mix..doesn't it alt.

 

alt : why do they(GPS) spend so much time writing about POP then?

 

michaelhait : alt They don't - or at least haven't in many years, since the GPS was developed

 

AfriVee : Yuppers we need to consider the Octagon as a point of departure.

 

alt : IMHO... a "good" tool being thrown away

 

michaelhait : A good book is Christine Rose - The Genealogical Proof Standard - also the BCG Standards Manual, wife just got home from grocery store - brb

 

alt : GPS.. and other groups have a tendency to "move" the goal line.

 

AfriVee : michaelhait and all its like a requirement of some societies saying one must be able to document five generations of a bloodline to prove rights to membership .. Is not the original premise faulty ???

 

Selma : Do they now need to add DNA..to prove the rights to membership

 

AfriVee : Well who decided 5 generations as the standard ???

 

Selma : The folks who could "prove" 5 generations afrivee... LOL

 

alt : heard a good presentation on DNA yesterday....the ONE thing that I got....DNA is an "exclusionary science" and not one of "inclusion" it can prove what you are not, but not what you are at a high degree of certainty i had to think on that one

 

AfriVee : It is so true from where I sit

 

vicky : hello AYWalton

 

AYWalton : Good afternoon all.

 

AfriVee : and so much in family findings is based on trust and faith

 

AYWalton : Hi vicky, Selma, lat, AfriVEE, khathu

taking a break from doing a few house chores.

 

2009-04-26 12:54:50 alt : anyone know the "ethnicity: of Michael?

 

AfriVee : howdy AYWalton we are getting deep up in here 2day Mz Angela

 

AYWalton : do you mean Michael Hait?

 

alt : yes AYWalton

 

AYWalton : he is white.

 

alt : okay thanks AYWalton

 

khathu : okay that makes sense

 

AfriVee : and he teaches African American family research as opposed to Genealogical Research methods, tools and resources to African Americans

 

AYWalton : here is his photo on this site:

http://genclass/african-american.htm

 

Selma : Does he teach these classes around MD AYWalton..or just online

 

AYWalton : just online. I think he is "breaking into" the African American specialty.

 

khathu : very interesting

 

alt : yes it is khathu.

 

AYWalton : he has also started writings articles about African American genealogy.

I saw it on Twitter.

 

khathu : I guess AA Lives Series made people aware that there is a market out there

 

AfriVee : I think his fee is $35.00 a class and a class duration is 4 weeks?

 

AYWalton : indeed.

 

alt : I take it that he is basically an "academic"

 

AYWalton : he begins his class for beginner with slavery.

 

Selma : Good grief......That says it all

 

AfriVee : And academic is fine and honorable HoWm So Ever

 

alt : no prblem with that AfriVee, my problem is when ALL of your experience is from a book.

 

Selma : He has been doing research for 20 years..just focusing on AA in the last 3

 

khathu : i agree alt

 

AfriVee : yes AYW he is following me on Twitter or Facebook

 

AYWalton : He wrote an article about ar how runaway slave ads are a genealogical tool for African American research.

 

Selma : Some of my best help has been from white researchers who know the records for the counties I research..so I have no problem with that..I look at the them and take what I need

 

AfriVee : well maybe yes and maybe no lol

 

AYWalton : yes, he is also following me on Twitter.

 

Selma : Is he adding your expertise to his work AYWalton..with credit I hope

 

AYWalton : he lives in Prince George's county MD, but has not yet connected with anyone in the AAHGS community, nor other parts of the African American genealogy community. I guess folks don't live on his street.

 

khathu : It never seem to amaze me that others alway become the "experts" on our experience

 

AfriVee : Agreed Selma teaching "tools and methods" is one thing

 

Selma : Aren't you being 'subjective" here Khathu

 

AYWalton : and khathu----there is a lesson in that!!!

not enough of us are stepping up to the plate.

 

khathu : i agree

 

alt : he impressed ne as not accepting of AA writings & research unless it comes out of an academic setting i.e. college of Unive.

 

AfriVee : khathu I think one can be an expert but we need to recognize the limitations of even an expert

 

khathu : Selma - I acknowledge my subjectivity

 

AYWalton : the fact is that those of us who have been doing this for years----we have knowledge and things to teach.

 

khathu : alt and that is his bias and subjectivity

 

AYWalton : Have you noticed who the budding "authorities" are for African Aemrican genealogy?

 

alt : right on khathu .. if it ain't accrording to GPS it ain't research...give me a break LOL

 

AfriVee : Well one faulty bit of marketing is offering a product without the finding that Black folk are slow if ever to pay to play genealogy

 

alt : sure have noticed AYWalton

 

AYWalton : This young man has declared himself capable of teaching genealogy to our own community.

 

khathu : for a fee

 

AYWalton : Another authority----Megan Smolenyak Smolenyak (yes, that's her name) She created Roots Television.

 

AfriVee : Well I suspect he is a good teacher

 

AYWalton : And she was an Afr. Am. authority at the NERC in New Hampshire this weekend. I have spoken with Michael.

 

alt : yep, I know Megan....she admits she is on a "learning curve" as relates to AA Research.

 

AYWalton : He is a nice guy, but in my opinion is limited in his knowledge.

But at the conference in NewHampshire----at the Ancestor Road show---she was an "expert" in African American genealogy. my opinion regarding teaching----you cannot teach what you don't know.

 

khathu : asante!

 

alt : yep, in the minds of the folks who put on the conference.

 

AYWalton : I can't teach Jewish genealogy and would NEVER begin a lecture with the Holocaust and then teach genealogy methods after that.

 

Selma : I guess the assumption is that we don't know any better...

 

khathu : i would also add you can not teach what you do not know or understand

 

AYWalton : But he began his Afr. Am. genealogy class with SLAVERY.

 

AfriVee : Well many of y’all might recall the civil war we fought with Myra Vander ??? on Prodigy some 20 years ago that there was no such thing as Black genealogy

 

Jay : AfriVee (!), Alt, AYWalton, khathu, Selma, vicky, hello!! :-)

 

AYWalton : I did write to him about that. I told him that we do not look in the mirror and immediately see "the product of slavery" staring back. We see ourselves as the products of our families.

 

AfriVee : and we all eventually jumped the Prodigy ship and found open arms at AOL

 

alt : I don't know how many of you belong to or associate primarily with "white" genealogy groups, but they are a "trip" when discussing AA research....

 

khathu : alt - i would have to agree with you

 

AfriVee : Tell me about it Alt

 

AYWalton : And he comes from that perspective----“gee this must be soooo hard for you all” They see slaves when they see us. I think he was surprised that I dove into why he was trying to teach slavery from lesson 1.

 

khathu : or are surprise when you know how to conduct the research

 

AYWalton : Of course he only has 2 students and only 1 of the 2 ever responded to him. But he has another class coming up in June.

 

AfriVee : absolutely and that view is pernicious and institutional

I do wish him well and we have not offered an alternative.

 

alt : exactly AYWalton... I have "big fun" and take great pleasure in out-researching the folks in my local genealogy groups....they come in with the Ellis Island cr*p and we can put our folks up who were here before the Rev War...blows their minds

 

Selma : I belong to any number of groups alt...I don't go to them to know about me..I go to them to know about them..cause at a point they are the ones generating the records

 

AYWalton : indeed, and the question does arise----where does he get the experience and/or the knowledge to conduct African American genealogy?

 

AfriVee : Tell it Selma... that is the fact of family research

 

Selma : I call it everything you ever wanted to know about white folk and them some.. LOL

 

AYWalton : He told me that he will offer an advanced level as well. I responded by telling him that advanced students are people who have done this for many years, and one of the first questions any advanced Afr. Am genealogist will ask is, "why don't I know you." Have not had a response to that email.

 

alt : I see your point Selma... and I try to use them as "resources", but also to let them know that AA's do have a history and it ain't all about slavery

 

AYWalton : I pointed out that there is a community and we may not know everyone, but we are visible even if in a small way, to each other.

 

khathu : It appears what he is teaching is basic stuff which can be obtain for free at any library, FHC, church, community center, etc.

 

Selma : If in fact he is an expert in Prince George..why isn't his focus on teaching folks everything there is to know about that county..and let folks decide what is applicabel

 

AYWalton : Well, only sort of---I have his syllabus.

He starts out lesson one with SLAVERY. I saw the videoit was fun to watch.

 

alt : wb michaelhait.....

 

AYWalton : I guess I am in between the boomers and the builders.

where is that church located? in what state?

 

khathu : i saw the video too

 

vicky : I think it was in Cali AY

 

alt : a question michaelhait..... how long have you been doing AA research?

 

AYWalton : I was suprised to see the folks really letting loose in the sanctuary like that.

 

AfriVee : Well AYW recall the group wanting to provide certification some years back

 

khathu : i'm the generation after the boomers and before the bridges

 

michaelhait : I just read what was being said about me while I was offline.

 

vicky : He told them they were not going to He#### lol

 

khathu : i was surprised by some of the songs they played in the church

 

vicky : It was in their era and of course we are all x somethings lol

 

khathu : it was good to see that they had alot of younger members in the church

 

michaelhait : alt I have been doing genealogy for around 20 years - I have done extensive AA genealogy for about 3-4 yrs. I am a professional, meaning I do client work - many AA clients who I have traced from current gens into & beyond 1860

 

AfriVee : I am glad to see you taking a break Jay from the routines of the day. I do that from time to time

 

michaelhait : AYWalton I was in the process of replying to your email earlier today - I thought I had explained to you that my course was initially designed for people who have some genealogical experience

 

khathu : Has anyone read James McBride new book Song Yet Sung

 

alt : okay michaelhait, thanks.. 20 years experience is good 3-4 AA research is a little lacking to be teaching it... IMHO

 

AYWalton : yes I was answering a question about the content. I do agree though that there should always be an emphasis to help beginners. I think AfriVee mentioned that many are not eager to pay.

 

alt : do you have an "area" of particular expertise in AA research...slavery, FPOC, Africa, etc.

 

AYWalton : I think that was AfriVee in an earlier meeting.

 

khathu : After reading the book I realized that there are still areas of the African experience that is still unknown or under researched

 

AYWalton : (correct me if I am wrong, though.)

and the lesson is many of us need to share what we have learned.

 

michaelhait : alt - was that directed toward me?

 

alt : yes michaelhait

 

khathu : For example - Slave Stealers

 

AfriVee : Yes, Michael and I discussed that a bit last night in fact I mentioned the poential for partnering

 

khathu : such as Patty Cannon and her son-in-law Joe Johnson

 

AYWalton : like Michael, as we have been doing this for some time (some of us a few years---not that we are getting old :) but it is a good idea to be bold enough to step forward and to share.THAT is the lesson. khathu---what county in MD was Patty? I can never remember and was telling someone about it.

 

alt : for sure AYWalton ..sharing is, I believe, the "credo" of AfriGeneas.

 

AYWalton : well that's true, alt, and AfriVee, Selma and myself were back in the old days of Prodigy even before .the old AOL chats

 

khathu : Caroline and Dorchester Counties

 

AYWalton : (of course we were mere children, mind you.)

 

AfriVee : lol

 

khathu : I never heard of slave stealers before

 

alt : yes, I know

 

AfriVee : Angela I was a child who was born in 1928 lol

 

michaelhait : My specialty is Maryland records, because that is where I have access to the records. But using online records I have traced families around the south - success depends on the accessibility of the records.

 

AYWalton : but all the more reason to start teaching, and presenting at workshops and teaching. and it is a good idea to specialize in my opinon. My research is mostly Arkansas and .Oklahoma, which is usually what I write about

 

khathu : i am now wondering how many enslaved Africans listed as runaways were actually kidnapped and sold to slave traders and sent to the deep south

 

AYWalton : and networking, of course is good.

khathu---I think if they were already enslaved then they were probably sold.

Free people were often kidnapped and sold south. Isn't that some of what Patty

Cannon did?

 

khathu : She took both freed and enslaved both mostly freed

 

AYWalton : I know she was on the eastern shore and often did capture FPOCs.

 

AYWalton : Michael do you also take in the Tidewater VA area? I think of of the eastern shore of MD and VA like Accomac VA when I think of the eastern shore.

I also know that some of the USCTs from that part went into VA.

that's a part that I want to visit---Accomac as the culture was a little different from what I have been told.

 

michaelhait : I am trying to do more networking - realized all of my work was relatively solitary and I would like more "like minds" to share with/learn from.

 

AYWalton : you have to just jump in and let folks know who you are.

 

alt : MD is an excellent State to do work on FPOC.. there were more of them than in any other State in the Union as of 1830 and on of the larger FPOC populataions as of 1860.

 

AYWalton : That is why I said what I said, many of us [i]old timers[/i] will definitely ask why don't I know you?

 

Selma : So what made you focus on AA research.. michael

 

AYWalton : so you gotta just jump on in for folks to know who you are.

 

michaelhait : AYWalton Haven't done AA work in the Tidewater area but I am relatively familiar w/ Va. records - govt system very similar to Md.

 

alt : as a matter of fact MD's FPOC population in 1830 was as large as the slave population.

 

khathu : alt - i invited descendants of the slave holding families to visit my website

 

AYWalton : well I have been paying a little attention to that area because it is geographically attached to MD.

 

alt : wonderful khathu

 

khathu : they were very impressed

 

michaelhait : Selma When I first began taking clients an AA approached me to work on her family. As I dug into the records I realized just how ignored the AA presence was...

 

AYWalton : alt you are correct, I believe that in 1860 the largest number of FPOCs came from MD.

 

AfriVee : Running y’all Have to do grocery shopping and I only risk driving between ten and three o clock.

 

AYWalton : Perhaps the client just did not realize that there is a very sizeable Afr. American genealogy community.

 

alt : as they should be... as you, or someone said earlier, good research is good research....period

 

michaelhait : Having grown up in Prince Geo Co. - which is 60-70% AA, I couldn't understand this, & decided to remedy the situation

 

AYWalton : People like Skip Gates also does not know this.

AfriGenas has over 1700 subscribers alone.

 

khathu : mainly because it is not in the mainstream media

 

AYWalton : and there is actually a very active and thriving Afr. Am genealical community in Prince George's County. The immediate past president of AAHGS is from Prince George's county. But again----there is the lesson----the community needs to do more to make itself visible. Several members of that group recently published a book on Afr. American history in the county. (Can't recall the title though.)

 

Selma : Is it one of those Arcadia books angela

 

michaelhait : There is very little published - in fact, even some of the books of land or probate recs, etc. will skip over the parts dealing w/ AA

 

Selma : Yes..that is the case in many places michael..thats why you need to go to the source...

 

alt : for sure AYWalton, not being in or from that area I wonder if there is a mentality by the "white" genealogy organizations that AA genealogy is not to be taken seriously... not meaningfuel or well researched

 

AYWalton : And if you Michael who has been doing research for over 20 years, are not aware of that group, then more has to be done to let people know that there is such a group. And you are quite right----more can be done---no question about that. Not only do many sources skip that history---those of us who DO research it---are obligated to share it. we must as I always say----keep documenting and keep sharing what we find. alt there is the perspective that it is soooo hard.

It is not soooo hard. But it is unique.

 

michaelhait : alt I think that is true everywhere - it took a lawsuit for the DAR to recognize AA RW soldiers - & some were even granted pensions by the govt!

 

alt : Louis Diggs, how well has his work on AA's in the city directories and such in the Baltimore area been received?

 

AYWalton : yes, one of our Baltimore members gained admission to the DAR on a black ancestor not a white ancestor.they had to learn to adjust their thinking.

as many people do.

 

michaelhait : Well... taking my family out to enjoy the beautiful weather... Have a great time everyone!

 

khathu : u do the same

 

AYWalton : alt, he has been received fairly well. bye Michael.

 

alt : yes and nice meeting you michaelhait

 

AYWalton : I think Louis Diggs has retired from writing his books.

There was an article on him in a local paper.He has covered all of the black communities. which we all need to think about doing.

 

Selma : Haven't heard his name in a long time AYWalton

 

AYWalton : he is still around. he said he was finished writing the books on the communities. He covered all of the black settlements in the county.

Baltimore County, that is.

 

alt : exactly AYWalton, my conern has become the AA's in my community dating back to 1805, not just my family who was here as AA's during that period.

 

AYWalton : hope you are writing about the, alt.

I always use my friend Agnes Callum as a model.

 

Selma : Well this has been an interesting Sunday Chat..

 

AYWalton : there I go again.

 

alt : everyday and everyway I can AYWalton .. in OGS journals, local gen newlsetters and other venues

 

AYWalton : that's great, alt.well I better tie myself down.

Maybe that is someone telling me to get back to my house chores.

I better get back to it.

 

vicky : cya AYW

 

alt : take care AYWalton

 

Selma : I gotta run too..everyone have a wonderful day.

 

AYWalton : take care everyone.

 

alt : this was a good chat session

 

khathu : yes it was

 

vicky : alt the Cards got a fella from Ohio Chris Wells

 

alt : you will like him vicky

 

vicky : thats what I want to hear alt lol

 

alt : big, powerful & fast

 

vicky : Browns made out also I heard

 

alt : you will be seeing highlights of him in the future...some of his outstanding runs for OSU 238 lbs. & out running DB's & Safties

 

vicky : alright!!

I better run also.. I want to go to the Library before it closes

take care alt

 

alt : okay take care

 

vicky : byee