Lunch Bunch Chat

2009-03-09  Monday

AftiGeneas Meeting Center



Chatters

11:54:53 [Login] vicky

00:20 [Login] yatah06

00:34 [Login] 3rdThawkins

07:01 [Login] Betton

07:01 [Login] Khathu

36:59 [Login] evanco

41:04 [Login] Selma

42:26 [Login] alt

42:32 [Login] Seventies Soulchi


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vicky : hello there Betton!. Hows it going with you?


Betton : everythings good how about with you guys

 now you know what you suppose to say lol


vicky : I hear ya my friend lol lol . Betton are you in Atlanta?


Betton : Columbus, Ga about 1.5 hours west of ATL


vicky : hold on a min will ya I have a paper I want to get


Betton : might go to ATL this weekend. I need to pop my brother upside his head...lol he told us this weekend he has an 8 year old daughter !!! right there in Atlanta


vicky : oh my You all never knew?? hey he may not have known


 Betton : he's known it all the time...he didnt wanthis ex 0wife to know because she might poison his other kids against her, so he was waiting for his son to turn 18 this yearmI can't believe he didn't tell us that


vicky : sometimes kids understand better than adults


Betton : he has a 19 and 17 year old by his ex wife. so what paper did you go get vicky


 vicky : Mabe we have the same brother Betton


3rdThawkins : they seem old enough to make their own decisions


Betton : he still hasn't told them


vicky : my brother last year did the same thing.. His son said "cool" I have a piece of paper that has Oakland Cemetery on it and lists Seaborn Burks as being buried there


3rdThawkins : I don't know what makes people do that, my step mother never told her two children, my older bro. and sis. about me and my brother, she raised them all these years and never told them they had two other bros. They found out just this past year from US


vicky : If you had been living in Atlanta I was gonna beg for a pic of stone 


Betton : I went to school with cousins and never knew we were cousins until I was married and grown. what stone vicky. who is seaborn burke


vicky :  cemetery stone or grave I should say

 Seaborn Burks is my gggrandfather people are so afraid of loss that they hide or forget to do whats right


Betton : I will have to see if I can find that cemetery, not familiar with atl. Does the grave have a stone


vicky : my x hubby found out on a humbug when he was around 19 that the parents that raised him were not his real parents. he was devestated and it took a long time to repair the trust back in the interm he was afraid to give love for fear the person would leave



3rdThawkins : My bro and sis were a little upset at their mother for not telling them, they might our dad ten years ago and dad mentioned us to them, but they was't sure what he was saying, their mother never made it a point to tell them they might-they met


vicky : this paper says blk 43 lot 3..thats all but dont go out of way if you do not live there Betton


Betton : my mothers uncle had an affair and had a child and his other children wouldn't accept her. So no one ever spoke of her. They lived in different cities. We played with her kids and went to school with them and never knew they were our cousins. vicky I am not sure if I am going to Atl theis weekend. I might go to Florida, but I will keep the info and when I am in ATL again I will look for it.


vicky : they are mad at the wrong people  :? 

great Betton thanks much. Whats in FL Betton besides sunny beaches


3rdThawkins : man! That's one thing I'm trying to get in contact with my paternal family, because I have cousins out there that don't know they have cousins, some may not accept me because of the race issue, but I know at least one probably will despite


vicky : race is no issue for youngsters these days 3rdthawkins


Betton : I have  cousins that in Jacksonville. She has big house and pool. Like to go and act rich for the weekend....lol

She is a big attorney there and David Garrard the QB for the Jaguars is our cousin also.


3rdThawkins : you probably right, but I don't know how my aunts took on their parents' view, they do not related or associate at all with blacks, so it may be hard for the kids (who are really kids at this point) to accept it father is mixed NA/AA and mother I think she is mixed with AA and she's Irish, she's very light skin. my gf and gm that is



 vicky : awesome! now you may have me rooting for the Jags lol


Betton : Actually I like the saints......lol I  only root for the jags on game days....lol


vicky : so what is the racial makeup 3rd.. father or mother white?

I am a cardinal fan but old school Cowboy fan and crazy about McNair with the Philly team lol lol


 Betton : what is NA?AA


3rdThawkins : Native American....African American


Betton : ok


vicky : so there should really be no problwem if both sides have the same makeup


Betton : Vicky what is your email address

I gonna ask my brother if he knows where that cemetery is


vicky : davissmitchell at afrigeneas.net


3rdThawkins : vicky, my grandmother lived her life as a white woman and disconnected from her famiy, my grandfather disonnected from his family, they both moved to D.C. and raised tehir children to view themselves as white...my dad ws one of few to view himself as Black. My aunts and uncles do not talk to each other, I don't think they all get along



vicky : you can email me any time even just to chitchat if you wish Betton


Betton : ok, I gotta run, but I will check into it for you. take care all, be blessed


vicky : have a great rest of the day Betton


 Khathu : interesting discussion


vicky : yes... My maternal grandmother who clearly could pass was asked to be in the movies. she turned them down and stated that her love for her parents prevented that and her love for herself. her funny comment was that she would rather be a light post in Texas lol lol


3rdThawkins : that's good, that's what was missing for my grandparents, especially my gf. Losing love for your family is losing love for yourself, and you start pretending to be other things that you are not and hurt not just yourself, but your family, your children and grandchildren


vicky : You never know what makes people tick.. perhaps those who passed wanted a better life for kids and they thought that may have been the way


evanco : Passing for what you are not often does have its negative things.


3rdThawkins : My grandmother had a sister who married an hispanic guy, so I guess she wanted to live her life as a hispanic woman..............my grandfather hated his black father for living his wife to raise 13 kids by herself. I'm not sure my grandmother and her siblings' reasons


evanco : Hey 3rdThawkings, did  your grandmother pass for what she was not? Remember, marrying outside of race is something else.


3rdThawkins : she was part white evanco, she passed for white


vicky : I have a first cousin who lives in Cali right now hates her dad for the same reason.  They had about 9 kids and soon after he left the mom got sick.. This cousin was the oldest had had to take on the role of mother They lived on a tenant farm in Brazos County Tx . The owners made them leave because they could not produce so they pitched a tent near the Brazos river and lived there



evanco : okay, 3rdThawkins, I got it. By the way there was a very lightskinned or almost cousin who showed up to many of the reuinions or other events, but when she returned to home in New York she was identified as white. Now when that cousin died, and all of the black relatives came to the funeral, like wow that really became news.


Seventies Soulchild : Y'all STILL talking about race from last week. Strong emotions associated with that issue & rightfully so. 


3rdThawkins : evanco, my grandmother was from New York, Mariah Carey is from the same area as my grandmother, and she's Irish descent also, as my grandmother


evanco : Question: Are there any people at least now under the age of 50 actually passing for white? That is just a curious question.


vicky : and sadly Selma , race will always be an issue along the way.


3rdThawkins : http://www.afrigeneas.com/forum-world/index.cgi?page=1,;md=read;id=2692 Seventies Soulchild take a look at this, this is why I don't think every relationship was the cause of rape


vicky : I have no idea evanco


3rdThawkins : evanco, my aunts and uncles


Selma : Race is an will probably be for a whlte the Elephant in the Room..Obama notwithstanding


evanco : 3rdThawkins, there age is what?


3rdThawkins : Wait! Actually most are over 50, I'm not sure about the ones under 50


Selma : I would think so 3rd..it ain't that long ago, that being black caused severe economic restrictions


alt : I'm sure there are evanco, I have a cousin in his 40's who married a white girl and they live in a community where there are very few, if any Blacks, I'm sure he si passing.


3rdThawkins : I think one under 50 is passing


evanco : My point, 3rdThawkins, because many many years ago it had to be done. Read a book Human Stain, about a professor who passed for white and who lived from the 1930s and into the 1970s.


Seventies Soulchild : 3rd, I understand that there were a few exceptions, but the majority of these cases especially AFTER that pre-colonial time frame, after that all were relationships of unequals.


Khathu : being bi-racial/multi-racial is in now

especially for people under 50


Seventies Soulchild : they had a name for this type of activity, paramour


3rdThawkins : YOu don't have to disconnect from your family get in tension with your kids when they marry black


Khathu : basically anything other that African-American/Black


3rdThawkins : I have one aunt who married someone from India and another married someone from the middle east, because the ydidn't want to marry white


evanco : I just do not see a reason in this society to pass for white simply because we have so many biracial folks, and many of us can be involved into almost anything in this nation or world.


Seventies Soulchild : If they had a name for it, then logically there would be a system in place. evanco, I'm black and I enjoy going into other countries and blending in with the other melanated people.


3rdThawkins : evanco maybe to keep themselves busy doing something... lol


alt : I don't know about that evanco......come out to the'boonies' and you will see there is still a reason for passing, much different life style than in the metro areas.


Seventies Soulchild : that is the line of demarcation, in my view, between US (melanin people) and them (little to no melanted people)


evanco : Seventies Soulchild, I mean why pass for white when you can blend into almost any society there is?


Seventies Soulchild : So only white skinned people can blend into any society? When melanin is the norm??


3rdThawkins : well evanco, not everyone passing just as white, my grandmoather's sister, I believe , passed as Hispanic


evanco : Yeah,alt, i see your point. Yet, even if I go into the boonies where the whole town is white, I feel that I do not have to pass now. Back in the 1950s and before that I would have.


Seventies Soulchild : Excuse the harshness, but I get tired of hearing this. I'm melanted and I'm in the majority of human beings in the world. I'm the majority, non-melanin is in the minority.


3rdThawkins : majority or non-majority, I just want my family to accept me despite race


Seventies Soulchild : I've gone to many places in this world and fit right in, no problem


evanco : 3rdThawkins, passing into the Hispanic mode is more of ethnicity. Some folks in my family look like certain Middle East folks.


Khathu : there is still alot of self hatred and the devaluing of the beauty of people of color especially people of African descent


evanco : What is so funny nowadays is when we look at a person and assume what they are and find out they are not. 


Seventies Soulchild : Why? because color of the skin is viewed as normal. Versus in the U.S. it is viewed as abnormal or defective


Khathu : European standards of beauty unfortunately are universal.


3rdThawkins : I don't know if you guys read my message above, but I do have one aunt (the one I recently spoke with) married a man from India, she does not have a problem with anyone of any race...and another aunt who married somone from the middle east


Seventies Soulchild : Here the closer you are to white, the better. Its d@mned insulting.


evanco : High cheek bones do not always mean Native American, some people whose skin may be of a very dark hue are not African exactly but could be from India. Many of the Ethiopians though from the continent, seem different from those in Africa.


3rdThawkins : I don't know if the aunt who married the middle eastern guy is passing as middle eastern, but I did find a website with her and her husband's name, and she sure is delving into that religion they have


Khathu : every pheno type in the world can be found in Africa


Selma : Last time I looked Ethopia was in Africa


alt : why can Europe have folks with so many different features and Africa is 'supposed" to be of one type?


3rdThawkins : lol alt right


Seventies Soulchild : And Africa also has the widest genetic diversity in the human population.


evanco : True that khathu, but if you told a person from India, not all though, that he may have ancestors in Africa, what will he/she say?


Khathu : It is done to justifiy the enslavement and colonization of African people in addition, it was done to continue the myth that any type of advancement or high civilization in Africa was the results of outsiders


evanco : The one thing, khathu, that I do know is that all over this world are persons with that blood of Africa, but they will not say it its true.


alt : If he knew anything about DNA & mutations he wouldn't say anything evanco...he would know he has African ancestry.


evanco : Who, alt?


alt : the person from India evanco


Khathu : to be African is still the worst thing one can be for most people including Africans in Africa 


3rdThawkins : Here in American, some black people can make it feel good to be light skin and be able to pass as white


evanco : Now Khathu let's get back to us those of us we call AfricanAmericans. We would rather be Native American, or something else other than African.


Khathu : Unfortunately too many of us see our heritage and history as one of shame 


3rdThawkins : Sometimes, black people can act like black is some kind of secret society, you gota to be a certain color, act a certain why talk and live a certan way in order to be black


alt : I heard an interesting comment on who were the 'enslaved" people from Africa.....not the everyday runof the mill not productive person.....the Slavers wanted skilled folks in all sorts of trades & areas.


3rdThawkins : And so they chose Africans.....alt 


Khathu : The notion of being descented from the noble savage (Native American) as opposed to the African savage is more appealing


alt : with "particular" skill sets 3rdThawkins 


evanco : alt, many of the slavers often tried to buy those slaves who at least had a trade, or if that slave was younger he would be taught the trade.


Khathu : Also we must keep in mind that when our ancestor stated that an individual were Native American it might necessary mean by blood 


 evanco : Also, alt, I heard the stories coming from ex slaves stating that one of their owners taught them to make tables and chairs, etc.


3rdThawkins : Khathu, I pretty much don't care, unlike some other AA's, I just tell people because that's just what it is in my family


Khathu : the ancestor could have identified with the culture 


alt : many came with those skills evanco....they had tables & chairs in Africa


Khathu : traditions, customs, or values of that particular tribe


3rdThawkins : Khathu, in South Carolina, there were Native Americans who identified as or with/related to blacks


evanco : Khathu, 3rdThawkins, many of us are identified within the culture of others...whether a white German, a Native American, or perhaps those who were Irish.


3rdThawkins : All I know is, I'm blaindianish


Khathu : evanco i was just adding another perspective to the Native American/African American discussion


alt : okay 'Tiger" lol lol 


evanco : Some Germans migrated from Pa., settled in N.C. set up churches and farms, sme owned slaves, who learned from slaveowners.  One cousin of mine married a Blackwelder, whose name in German is Shwartzwalder. By the way Otis Blackwelder was black, took on the master's name.


vicky :  lots of Germans in Tx....same senario evanco


evanco : vicky, good. Once again, when we search into our families, it is always good to research regions, areas, and the locals of that time. 


3rdThawkins : yeah, it makes me wonder if my grandmaother was from South Carolina, there are a lot of Ireland born people in Charleston, my grandfather's grandfather worked for a family from Ireland when he was a kid, her SSN was issued in South Carolina. her obit says Long Island, New York, but I think I believe that more


vicky : send for her application 3rdthawkins.. she would have filled that out herself


evanco : The House family I am related to have German background, with a little of Catawba and Cherokee background. The other family the Crowell family are mostly Cherokee people. The Evans side are really Irish, though Evans is a Welch name


3rdThawkins : and if her maiden name is Gordon, there are a ton of Gordons in Charleston...but I would believe New York, because we do have family there, so I believe she was born there, I believe she and my grandfather met nad married in D.C. ok, I will have to do that vicky 


evanco : Hey folks this was a nice chat, but I gotta go, so take care and peace and blessings to all.


3rdThawkins : arlight evanco


alt : the MInerd tombsrone that vkn posted about last week......those are Rita's people from SE Ohio, Athens Co., her g-ma was a Minerd


vicky : did she know that alt when she posted/


alt : vkn, I doubt it, but Rita knew of the tombstone and the website mentioned...she has contributed quite a bit of information to that site.


vicky : I see..still great though


alt : yes, it is posted in the cemetery forum by PF

  

vicky : have a good one Selma

I cant type fast..I use one finger on each hand

well son if you can order that application.. I don't know the cost but it will provide much needed infoname of parents, addresses age etc etc


3rdThawkins : yeah, hope so, do you think there's any chance a person would lie on their application.?


vicky : no not on that I dont think...especially with the app. They would have to provide proof of age. I know I had to bring my bc and that was eons ago


3rdThawkins : But grandmothe was 10 in 1940, and was 19/20 in 1950 when she married my grandfather, so I don't know.  I would like to find her and my grandfather in the 40s, if I could, don't know how


vicky : well that is something different. They could marry at 16


3rdThawkins : well, she married at 19 or 20


vicky : so no need to lie on SS


3rdThawkins : my grandfather was probably still in Charleston when he was 18


vicky : send for both apps


3rdThawkins : ok, I'll have to check it out...I will


Vicky : also he had to register for the draft


3rdThawkins : yeah, I didn't order his military records yet or at least send for them, they are free I believe


vicky : ok will gotta run now..take care

3rdThawkins : ok, you too vicky bye


2009-03-09 13:25:55 [Logout] vicky