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Start: 11:18:41
End: 14:27:00
Chatters: alt, David, daviss, deannie, Godfrey, Ingrid_Doweary, jhonora, keli1, Khathu, ProfessorDru, Selma, Spivey, vkn, We went to lunch together with some others of he

David: Hello Khathu!

Khathu: good morning David We are a little early. The Sunday Brunch Chat starts at 11:30 EST

David: Gosh! I am so used to joining late, I don't know what to say when I am second to arrive! OK, that explains it!

Khathu: Any new discoveries, brickwalls, etc

David: Two news. I attended the free conference at Norfolk State University Friday, "Race, Slavery and the Coivil War: the Tough Stuff of American History."

Khathu: Great! how was the conference welcome back

David: I lost connection to internet! They had 2 panels of 5 prominent historians each, plus James Horton as panels' moderator. The organization and facilities of the conference were top notch!

Khathu: I am glad to hear that.

David: Here is a link to the program:

Khathu: So what are the names and areas you are researching

David: I do everyone in Upson County, Georgia, with emphasis on slaves and freedpeople 1825-1875

Khathu: Hello Godfrey

David: Good morning Godfrey!

Khathu: Are you David Paterson?

David: Yes

Godfrey: Good morning David and Khathu (this is Selma)..I am at a friend's showing them how to get in he chat

Khathu: Nice to "meet" you

Godfrey: Hey David...

Khathu: Okay....hello Selma and friend

Godfrey: S

David: GM Selma! I am trying to figger out how to paste a link into this machine

Khathu: Hello Ingrid

David: Khathu, likewise!

Ingrid_Doweary: Hey Godfrey, David and Khathu

Godfrey: Selma is leaving...going home to get on my own computer... LOL

Khathu: See David, I told you people will start arriving around 11:30

Ingrid_Doweary: How is everyone ?

David: Ingrid, I'm blessed to be here! Great!

Khathu: So Godfrey what surnames and areas are you researching

Ingrid_Doweary: Wonderful. Glad you join us.

David: Yes, Khathu, right on time!

Khathu: Ingrid - David and I arrived about 20 minutes ago and I was explaining to him that the sunday chat starts at 11:30 hello alt

Ingrid_Doweary: Hey Alt, how goes it?

alt: Hello David, Godfrey, Ingrid & Khathu

Godfrey: hi david,this is alice godfrey friendof selms

Khathu: hello keli1

alt: HI Keli1

Ingrid_Doweary: Hey Keli1/

keli1: Good morning to all....

David: Hi Alice! Hi Keli

keli1: I have a question if I am not interrupting a topic

Godfrey: I am desentd from the slave godfrey in va.

keli1: I am stuck not finding my folks in the 1870 census, I have then in 1850 adn 1860, but lose the whole family in 1870, and they reappear in 1880 who is still alive, how would you tackle this challenge

alt: David, to post a link tho chat a "copy" of the URL and then click on CTL+V.

Ingrid_Doweary: Keli1, were they alive in the same state in 1880 as the state in1850?

keli1: yes

Khathu: have you done a line by line research of the census

alt: you've check in surrouding counties keli1? perhaps they are just mis-indexed for 1870

Khathu: don't use the index

David: This is the link I was trying to share with Khathu on the Race, Slavery and the Civil War Conference I attended Friday

keli1: I am now scanning for various spelling of the name which I have done over and over, have checked the surrounding counties, used soundex, no death records appear either

Khathu: thanks david

alt: are you searching on Ancestry keli1?

keli1: @David I listened to both session last night, actually till early morning, I thought it was excellence!

Khathu: are you researching by last name?

David: keli1, Tell us how you have identified them in 1860 and 1850

keli1: @Art, used ancestry, footnote, worldvital,, etc

alt: nad the program has been posted on-line Khathu, I was watching some of it earlier this AM.

Ingrid_Doweary: Thanks for the link David.

keli1: they are in the 1850 & 1860 census, not in 1870, but all are still alive

David: Were they free people or slaves?

keli1: they are free

Godfrey: david, in my godfrey familY I HAVE a david whohas a

alt: keli1, on Ancestry I frequently use the AA filter and just look for AA's in a state/county and/or twonship ... no names.

keli1: my mission today is to check different first letters, for example last name Goings, I will check Joings, Ioings, Soings, etc, all letters that hang over

Godfrey: twin sister named polly b/in bedford va.

keli1: yes, used AA, I have resorted to flipping every page of the 1870 census for Jefferson County WV,

alt: Ancestry..*oin* *ow**, etc.

Ingrid_Doweary: Hey Keli1, you might check for a change in spelling for the family surname. Sometimes spelling was an issue with the transcription process.

Khathu: i would suggest that you look for the family using their first names

David: Keli I assume you are searching the censuses online. Using the online search engines, I would geographically broaden my search in 1870. Also look for possible misspelling of the surname

keli1: that is good, forgot about the * Art...I will try that as well

Ingrid_Doweary: I concur, David.

keli1: Yes have scanned through all the adjacent counties, I have one more to do

Khathu: i have an ancestor who was named Ned Hardin but was listed as Hardin Marshall in the 1870 Census

David: Goyens, Goyen

keli1: I can track them everyone else except 1870, kind of weird, before and after

alt: any u'unusual' given names in this family? try first name searches w/wild cards.

Khathu: it was only after research by the first names of the family members was i able to locate the family in 1870

keli1: @Khathu, I resorted on my Marsh family that I look for Mash and Marshall

David: Do they live in the same neighborhood in 1860 and 1880? If so, find the neighbors in 1870 and look in their neighborhood.

alt: first names, race & approx. birth years often will do it keli1

keli1: I have 22 different spelling of Goens/Goings, now, so that is why I am trying other letters that hang over the line like a G, J, I, F, maybe even a S.

Khathu: The family was only listed as Marshall on the 1870 census. Every other document inlcunding the 1867 Voter Registration the family is listed as Hardin

keli1: They are all in the same county and neighborhood, but whole family gone, neighbors are still there in 1870 that were there in 1860 and 1880

Khathu: so expand your search to what alt suggested first names, race, approx age, place of birth, etc

David: And yes, Alt the * is magic. Someone showed me that last week and folks I couldn't find to save my life popped right up! Turned oput they were hidden by an indexing transcription error.

Ingrid_Doweary: Yes, Keli1, I encountered that problem with my Doweary's of Carrol Co., MD and Averys of Columbia Co., AR>

keli1: I have searched with just first names, they have not appreard in that state, but will do with the other letters today I would call this a challenge not a brick wall, lol...been dealing with it for the last few years and still have not resolved it not just census, I also checked death, marriage and land records

alt: and keli1,, folks sometimes moved out of a state for a time period, the came back, perhaps they are even in another state for 1870.

David: If your place of interest has tax digests, see if the HOH paid taxes there around 1870

Ingrid_Doweary: However based on the 1st three children's birth year, I learned that my Lintons of Lee Co., AR did live in Cairo, Alexandria Co., IL for a few years.

Khathu: i have several individuals i am unable to locate in the 1870 census but i am able to locate them in various county records for the same time period

keli1: they did not own any land, when I say they all disappeared that is tracking the children as well, it just baffles me that is true, the only county I have not checked is the 1870 census for Loudoun, I hit all others so far surrounding Jefferson WV

alt: Ingrid_Doweary, I have a friend, surname THORPE from that area of Illinois.. they came there in the 1880's from Henry co., TN.

Ingrid_Doweary: Henry Co., TN, eh? Wonder what vicintiy that is from Heyward Co. TN?

keli1: interesting know how one thing just keep sticking in your side, now it is an obession to find them, how can I not find them when I teach genealogy 101 classes, lol

David: If other records confirm their presence in the county, search the census page by page. It may just be that theuy were not enumerated. In the 1850 Upson County, GA, census, the enumerator skipped a whole secion of the county and omitted about 20% of the population. Admittedly an extreme example.

keli1: Ingrid, I do research in Greene, Loudon, Knox TN

alt: I think it is in that area near the southern IL border Ingrid_Doweary

Ingrid_Doweary: I hear ya, Keli1. It's one of those mysteries of Genealogy. :} The tax records are a good lead, David.

David: Before the days of census maps and when enumerators had to construct their own routes, it was certainly possible to accidentally skip people.

alt: and as someone has suggested perhaps the given/surnames were transposed on the census and then indexed that way.

keli1: really David, interesting, I see neigbhors, know I need to scroll to the end of the census in case there are any lingering notes

Ingrid_Doweary: I think so too, Alt. Got to get my maps out.

keli1: I checked the transposing, Lawson Goings to Goins Lawson, he is the only one with a different name, other than that, it is Joseph, William, John, Mary, Sarah/Sallie, Nancy, etc...common names

Khathu: in addition, a totally different name could have been used. For example my ggg grandfather is listed as E. Platt in the 1870 census but his name was Essex Simpson on every other document those are my two examples

keli1: Khathu, hmmmm, how did you determin it was him

Ingrid_Doweary: I've encountered that also, Khathu.

alt: Man, Familysearch is getting better & better.. I'm finding folks in a NC data file from immediately after the CW... really answering a lot of questions for me.

Ingrid_Doweary: Way to go, Alt!

Khathu: first i had to due a line by line search of the county, comparing first names of the family, approx age, place of birth, and race

keli1: Yes it is, but also make sure you use the regular search and also do search records drop down and use pilot search Lawson doesnt show up on regular but does on pilot search and also not on the beta site

David: If your people were landowners, check the deeds and then plot the land lot/s against the a contemporary map of the county. Were they some distance from a main road, where they might have been overlooked?

Khathu: i also examined county records to confirm that he was in the county

alt: as everyone is saying keli1 , try to widen your search parameters... and alos look for 'companion' type records for that location/period.

keli1: that is how Irita found Lawson Goings and I didn't, I was just using regular search on their site,

Ingrid_Doweary: I truly appreciate how you all present various resource leads here, folks :)

keli1: Yea, I will continue to widen....I don't want this to become a wall, I am okay with it as a challenge..great input

Khathu: also keli1 - i used the microfilm at the nara to locate both families. i find it easier to do page by page with the microfilm

alt: who might have been of marrying age during the missing census year. or having more children, dying, etc.

Ingrid_Doweary: The plot thickens and you investigation, Keli1 has expanded.

keli1: it is redoing what I have done over and over with a different eye open, no matter how long you been doing this, there is a chance I have overlooked something

alt: aw naw lol lol

Ingrid_Doweary: I conur, Khathu. The microfilms are what I ultimate cross reference with.

keli1: I have access to all of the marriage records and deeds online and in the court house for Jefferson County VA and WV

Khathu: Hello Spivey

Spivey: Hi everyone!

Ingrid_Doweary: You=your. Hey Spivey.

alt: Hello Spivey....

David: I would really investigate the tax records if they exist for 1870. For example, did the law require all adult males to pay a poll tax, regardless of whether they owned real estate or other taxable property? If so, you should find adult male family members in the tax records. If they were organized by district they will also give you a part of the county in which they lived. If they are in the 1869, 1870, 1871 tax digests but not the census, then I would conclude they were there but not enumerated.

keli1: was at the LDS center viewing microfilm not trusting all of what is online, will have to go back to it

Ingrid_Doweary: For sure, Keli1.

David: Hello spivey!

Spivey: H David. I don't believe we have met. Pleased to make your acquaintance.

keli1: David they did not own or sell anything or taxed for anything that we have found, for the whole 10 yr span, hi Spivey

Ingrid_Doweary: David, clarify the difference between poll tax an property for me, please.

David: If your targetted state had a "homestead exemption" law, as many did during Reconstruction, see if your family HOH or wife applied for homestead exemption.

Ingrid_Doweary: Keli1, if resident has rental property-items, animals, etc., they paid taxes on rentals.

alt: also does Va have voter registration records by county... lots of folks were voting for the first time in the 1870's elections.

keli1: yes, I agree, nothing at tax or clerk's office with this families name on it, I also hit the newspapers

David: Ingrid, some states like Georgia taxed all male adults up to a certain age. The poll tax is literally a "head tax" -- and even folks who rented their homes and land and didn't own any taxable property had to pay poll tax. In most jurisdcitions that had poll tax, voters (who were also limited to adult males) had pay the tax to be able to vote. Enforcement varied.

keli1: they do have voter registration and nothing came up, lol

alt: didn't this Goings (?) group start migrating into Jefferson, Trumbull & Columbia Co., Ohio during this time period keli1

Spivey: David, where in Georgia would these records be kept? At the local level or at the State Archives?

Ingrid_Doweary: Thank you, David! :)

keli1: No, not that I know of Art, they went to MD, but after 1880, and the reseacher up there have checked thinking they parents might ben in one of their children's households, but I can account for all of the children, except one, who we assumed remarried

alt: are these the same lines Robert goings is researching keli1?

Khathu: have a great day everyone

keli1: the same line but another sibling...

alt: ah so keli1, okay

Spivey: David , where in Georgia would these records be kept? At the local level or at the State Archives? Hi daviss!

keli1: I appreciate all the input, I took notes on all suggestions to share and make a to do list...hopefully it helps someone else as well

alt: hi daviss

daviss: Good morning/evternoon!

keli1: Hi Daviss...good afternoon

Ingrid_Doweary: Hey Daviss

alt: BTW keli1, congrats on your 'new' AAHGS group.

keli1: thanks, we are excited also picked up two more members...I might be the only one making it to the conference, but will represent

David: Tax records were county records. Some counties have transfered their oldest records to the state archives. Most are also microfilmed and the state Archives holds the film. A copy of Tax records was held by Superior Court. Applications for Homestead exemptions were made to Court of ordinary [now called Probate Court]

alt: I know you will keli1

keli1: did you decide to go?

Ingrid_Doweary: That's the spirit, Keli1! :}

keli1: I am presenting on WW2 research

daviss: How many in your group now keli1

alt: me, nope, got too many 'local' things going on during that period.

Spivey: Thank you David. David, do you research in Georgia and, if so, which counties or is it the whole state?

keli1: 12 for now, we have a goal to get to 20 by next year

David: Mainly Upson County

daviss: You are well on your way my friend! Thats great

Ingrid_Doweary: Excellent, Keli1.

alt: are all of your AAHGS folks located in the same county keli1?

keli1: We have Bob O'Connor coming in Nov to speak on his books, etc, so we are excited about that... we are AAHGS Chapter of Central VA, so cover all counties surrounding Albemarle and the city of Charlottesville..

Ingrid_Doweary: Daviss, my husband appreciated seeing the A-Am Newspaper article with his father's photo.

alt: okay keli1, that's like our group, we cover a 9 county area in midwestern Ohio....

Spivey: I don't have Upson on my list right now, David. My areas are Bibb, Jenkins, Screven, Burke, and Houston. Upson may come later, though as I gather more information. Do you do any research in either of the counties I mentioned?

Ingrid_Doweary: He told me to send it to his sisters and niece to see who will be the 1st to print it and show it to their mother.

keli1: yep and went to each of the historical societies and other groups to host our meetings to tell us about their county and resources, so far the schedule is growing, Louisa Co. VA stepped up first

Ingrid_Doweary: Wow, Alt. Sounds like a vast coverage.

keli1: I joined the new Greater Richmond Chapter and work on the program committee, so I won't miss anything, lol

daviss: thats wonderful ingrid! Glad I cfound it. Now I hope I can find your pauline

alt: not really Ingrid_Doweary,, in terms of area they are all within a 50 mile radius of each. other.

Ingrid_Doweary: Oh, that's great to know, Keli1. I plan to to visit Louisiana in less than 2 yrs for a family reunion-Cummings. Oh okay, Alt, thanks.

alt: this is a 'rural' area, towns are usually no more than 15-20K in population with small AA demographic.

Ingrid_Doweary: Yea. Daviss thanks for the inspiration.

David: Spivey, I live in Virginia, so I no mlonger do much in-person research. I harvested most of my data on Upson County years ago, and I am still digesting t.

Ingrid_Doweary: I comprehend, Alt.

Spivey: Did you say Virginia David?

keli1: I agree with Art some of the Virginia counties are small, but what is so interesting is that the families migrated to the adjacent counties so we are tracking movement and finding so many connections

David: Yes, that's where I live, but all my research interests are in Georgia, mainly Upson

keli1: Hi David I am in Virginia as well

David: Norfolk

keli1: Fluvanna area is where I live, work in Charlottesville

alt: exactly keli1, this area is 'full' of inter-related marriages between counties.

daviss: I have a Seaborn Burks?Burks in Ga lol but the cat has my tongue on the county sheesh

keli1: David did you make the Civil war events

alt: and did you see Selma?

Spivey: Oh. Too bad. I would love to get a clue to follow on one of my ancestors who was born in Virginia around 1816. That's all I have on him in Virginia, his name, parents' names, sibling, and approximate date of birth.

David: I very much enjoyed last Friday's conference at Norfolk State University

keli1: with the central virginia history researchers, we have started in Albemarle Co with two plantations and tracking the families/descendents, etc, we have a database up on the web

daviss: hello user

keli1: hi User

Spivey: David, can you recommend some online resources for researching in Georgi and Virginia?

We went to lunch together with some others of he: Yes, Selma saw me first! We went to lunch together with some of her other friends.

alt: now that is some interesting research keli1, I've tried to do that with the slaves of John Randolph who migrated to this area following their freedom in 1846.

daviss: You sure have a long name lol lol

Ingrid_Doweary: Hey there "We went to lunch together with some others of her friendsDavid"

keli1: I was excited watching the presentations online last night

Spivey: We went to lunch together with some others of her friendsDavid how are you? WHO are you? WHERE are you?

We went to lunch together with some others of he: Amazing isn't it? Call me what you will, but don't call me a computer chat wizard!

keli1: check it out, we obtained a small grant as well to build the database, kind of a new concept

daviss: lol @ user

Ingrid_Doweary: Is that the ""Race, Slavery and the Civil War: The Tough Stuff of American History and Memory" presentation you're speaking of Keli1?

Spivey: Interesting.

keli1: yes, Ingrid, Selma posted the link last night and someone posted it today, my butt didn't go to bed till about 3:30a

daviss: wb david

Ingrid_Doweary: WB David.

Spivey: Welcome back David. Hi Selma!

daviss: hello Selma

keli1: and here she is! Hi Selma

Ingrid_Doweary: So who did you have lunch with, David? Hey Selma.

Selma: Finally

David: Ingrid. Very funny. :) Selma and her friends

Spivey: Welcome back Ingrid.

alt: Hi Selma

Ingrid_Doweary: Sorry, logged out prematurely. Thank you.

daviss: wb ingrid!

Spivey: Hi ProfessorDru!

ProfessorDru: howdy gang

keli1: Hi Dru, howdy

Ingrid_Doweary: I understand your answer, David. Hey ProfDru!

alt: hello ProfessorDru

daviss: hello professordru

Selma: Interesting article in CVS Journal keli on manumisisons in Albemarle Couty...

ProfessorDru: just got back in from HU opening convocation.

Selma: Had some good fried fish... LOL and viggie veggies For the school year Dru

David: Spivey, what time period and kind of information?

ProfessorDru: yep Selma, I found the Davis folder and looked at it this morning before I left.

Ingrid_Doweary: HU opening convocation, ProfDru?

Selma: Davis?

ProfessorDru: yes, Ingrid, Hampton University

David: Selma, would that be "The CVS Journal. The Official Newsletter of Charlotte Van & Storage"?

ProfessorDru: The Austrialian immigrant

alt: I'm watching it in 30 minute segments just for that reason Keli1

Ingrid_Doweary: Oh, your opening convocations are on Sundays?

ProfessorDru: yep, ingrid

keli1: yes Selma by Gayle, she also did a report on the Slaves at UVA

alt: no that was good reading keli1 .. Slaves at UVA.. thanks!!

Spivey: David, his name is Coleman Adams, Jr. Father Coleman Adams, mother Mary [maiden surname unknown]. Coleman Jr was born in Virginia around 1813, his sister Dicey around 1816. I first found Coleman on the 1880 census for what is now Jenkins County, Georgia. Coleman died in

alt: no=now

Ingrid_Doweary: Oh okay. Over past 3 yrs. the university library remained opened during convocation, so we weren't allowed to attend.

Selma: No central VA genealogical society

keli1: yes Central VA, her name is Gayle Schulman

David: Selma, OK, I guess Google isn't always right!

Spivey: David, Coleman Adams Jr died 10 October 1894 in Screven County, Georgia.

keli1: the UVA report is not in this edition it was in another publication

Ingrid_Doweary: This year the University of the District of Columbia will suspend classes but of the Learning Resources Division will remain open-remove us from attending. Hey Vkn.

keli1: hi VKn

Selma: David I think the conference would have been morelively if folks could have asked question directly..although they we have probably hogged the mikes..

alt: hello vkn

Spivey: Hi vkn!

vkn: Good Howdy to each and everyone

Selma: Spivey..where was the family in 1870

David: Spivey, I can't speak much about Virginia online resopurces, but for Georgia, you are probably going to use the internet as a finding aid to locate specific hard-copy records and plan to visit.

Spivey: I cn't find them in 1870 Selma.

daviss: hello vkn!

Selma: David there were a number of Sons of the Confederacymembers there taking copious notes

David: Agreed. I didn't kmow about the "blue question forms" until too late for the first session. Anyway, they HATED my question.

Spivey: I have been doing both David. I want to visit Georgia again the end of this year and will try to get to the Probate Court and Superior Court in Jenkins County as you suggested to look for homestead and tax records. Thanks for those suggestions.

keli1: there are tons of resources online for Virginia, I would start with Google or the actual county genweb, and remember don't forget WV, if reseaching prior to the civil war

vkn: alt David daviss Ingrid Kell ProfessorDru Selma Spivey Glad to see all y'all

David: And that's good. SOCV should be taking good notes if they are there in the spirit of learning.

daviss: brain just started to work Spivey! My Ga county is Wilkes

Selma: Follks were blogging too David...but I haven't found the blogs yet

keli1: @Art do you know if Robert G applied for DAR dealing with Sherod Goings/Albemarle

David: Also review my guide to finding slaves in Georgia records, at AfriGeneas

keli1: vkn, don't forget me, lol

Spivey: I think there may be some connections between Wilkes and SPIVEY and ADAMS daviss.

alt: how did the consenus 'cause' for the CW go over with the SOCV Selma... like a rock probably LOL

David: Hi VKN

vkn: keli1 never ever forget lol

Ingrid_Doweary: Happy you joined us, Vkn!

keli1: merci beaucoup!

alt: don't know about Robert and the DAR keli1

ProfessorDru: Do any of you have access to the World records through Ancestry?

vkn: merci merci and a beaucoup also

ProfessorDru: hey vkn

Selma: I think I do dru...LOL

Spivey: I do ProfessorDru.

daviss: not me ProfessorDru

keli1: I do

Selma: But I could be wrong

David: The trouble with many SOCV is that they are not motivated by historical inquiry. They are agenda driven so they pick and choose their evidence.

Selma: How would I know

keli1: world vital records-Dru?

vkn: ProfessorDru looking forward to seeing you in Hotlanta

keli1: oh no I don't thru Ancestry, I only have United States

daviss: Spivey I have Burks and Lester in Wilkes County

keli1: you would pay more

daviss: they intermarried

vkn: I think I do Prof

Selma: Me and vkn...we THINK we do.. LOL

vkn: lol

Spivey: daviss, the surname Burks is familiar. Presumably, some SPIVEYs and ADAMSes were sold to BURKS.

alt: if you're paying 199.00 p/y you have it vkn & Selma

ProfessorDru: ok. thanks everyone. I'll email Selma since this is needed for a project she gave me of a slave from Greensville County, VA who immigrated to Australia in 1849. looking forward to see you also vkn

daviss: sheesh alt I thought my 160 was high lol

vkn: David great response re slave newsletter

Ingrid_Doweary: lol lol Daviss!

David: I knew Kelly Barrow personally (author of "Black Confederates") when I lived in Georgia. Very earnest, very honorable, very Christian, but very agenda driven. A school teacher, also, teaching our next genration!

vkn: It be 199 alt so I do prof Dru

ProfessorDru: I only have the US I pay about $150

keli1: yep more money.. wonder if I should ventured outside the US for my William Michael Murphy, lol, smh

Spivey: vkn, I just renewed my world subscription to and I paid $299.40 + tax for a total of $323.35.

alt: ProfessorDru, I think there are some Australian records on the Familysearch pilot & beta sites.

David: VKN thanks for the link

keli1: there are some Alt../free

ProfessorDru: thanks alt

vkn: oh dear our kids will be more confused David

David: VKN -- I like your new FaceBook picture -- you and your Apple!

vkn: whoa spivey

Selma: Scary about Burrows

keli1: you all did see that footnote and ancestry coming together, which I already thought they owned it

Spivey: I renewed it yesterday vkn so that is the current price.

Selma: I tell you its a plot for Ancestry to take over the world and by extension...

vkn: David yes nothing like a bite of da apple lol

Spivey: The takeover was annouced early this week keli1.

Ingrid_Doweary: I'm sorry, I got behind. What were you looking for ProfDru in World Ancestry?

alt: Ancestry is becoming more & more 'scary'.. they are too much about the 'business' anymore.

vkn: True that Selma

Selma: they were always about the business Alt

vkn: True that Selma and alt

keli1: Selma, they already too it over....just getting bigger...and it is kind of scary that they know so much about the world

Spivey: alt, if I'm not mistaken, Ancestry itself was taken over.

alt: yes, but now they're 'gobbling' up everything Selma

keli1: Art, I settled on rebuilding my database with MacFamilyTree instead of going back to FTM, so far love it, it does kinship reports

vkn: Spivey you be mistaken

alt: part the The Generation Network..

keli1: Ancestry is the the LDS Church, part of their Mission...they have taken over and will continue

Spivey: Yes. The Generation Network purchased Ancestry some years ago to my understanding vkn.

alt: wonderful keli1.. you're a MAC person?

vkn: Spivey you be mistaken gotta watch the name thing but Ancestry remains the GIANT

keli1: oh yea MAC lady here

Spivey: The giant is The Generation Network vkn.

Ingrid_Doweary: Isn't that merging FamilySearch with Ancesty?

keli1: FTM crashed on me a couple of years ago and noone was able to retrieve my files, had over 1000 names, gone, FamilySearch is LDS, which is Ancestry look at the copyright, etc

Ingrid_Doweary: Ancestry formerly The Generation Network .

Spivey: I was disabused of that belief keli1. The Generation Network is the parent company of but does not own FamilySearch which is owned by the Latter Day Saints.

vkn: Not to let the name confuse is all I can say

alt: os when we say we like A better than B or C we may be talking about the 'same' folks, just with a diferent twist.

keli1: they are all linked...

Selma: They are all linked to the LDS church

Spivey: No they aren't linked keli1.

daviss: all I know is someone gets my 160. 00 once a year :?

keli1: yes yes yes...they are, I do a lot of LDS work/local, they are linked. different names, lots of money moving and I love paying it lol daviss

Ingrid_Doweary: Here's a link referencing the Generation NT and Ancestry:

Spivey: Okay keli1. There are employees of the Latter Day Saints who say they're not linked, but you would know.

Ingrid_Doweary: Right Spivey.

keli1: Did anyone see the National Book Festival that is airing on Cspan, great presentations, nell Irvin Painter was on last night and others

daviss: I didn't keli1 but will sure check it out

vkn: and Adele Logan Alexander who writes about women in Middle Georgia

alt: naw keli1.. gotta miss sumpin', can't take it all in LOL LOL

keli1: Spivey not saying I know all, just only what I was told and it is easy to check, just look at copyright info and track to LLCs, etc..

Selma: I missed Keli..will catch later..but did see a presentation from Aug of author of book on Effects of Civil War on children..white and black free and enslaved..gotta find title

Spivey: Fine keli1. It' okay.

keli1: it was good, now who was that Selma?

Selma: Let me see if I can find the paper I wrote it downon

vkn: and Adele Logan Alexander who writes about women in Middle Georgia keli1

keli1: The guy that just put out the book called Bridge (Obama) was on, great interview

Ingrid_Doweary: Another FYI link for ya.

keli1: I missed that one Vkn

Selma: Author: Anya Jabour

keli1: Missed that one, will search for it, it sounds interesting

Selma: Book: Topsy Turvey - How the Civil War Turned the World Upside Down for Southern Children

Ingrid_Doweary: Posting this link in place of the other.

Selma: Great book keli..the Bridge

Ingrid_Doweary: I refuse to support Andrew Breitbart.

alt: I saw sumpin' bout the remnants of slavery Selma.. a "stat" I hadn't really looked at is the from the slave narrative's taken in the late 1930's.. if you knew any of those folks tha places you only one generation away from slavery .. imagine that!!!

keli1: Ingrid I see it, and note the Provo connection

Spivey: That is the interesting one Ingrid_Doweary especially in light of the takeover of Footnote by Ancestry. Both companies were hired to work with the LDS in the digitization project, now Ancestry has Footnote's share of the pie.

keli1: I am thinking of getting the Bridge

Ingrid_Doweary: Yep.

ProfessorDru: gotta run

keli1: on the Civil War presenations-one presentor covered Harriet Jacobs, she was interesting as well, Narratives from a Slave girl

Selma: It is hard to imagine alt..but true

keli1: 1930s, wow Art, where did you see that sumpin'...

vkn: Daviss whatever happened to Nadasue

keli1: I been scanning John H. Russell, "the free Negro in Virginia 1619-1865" book, so far it has interesting views

alt: the Ohio Historical Society has some slave narratives of folks taken in 1937 who lived here in Springfield, Ohio... I personally knew some of those people as I was growing up keli1

Selma: I made a copy of that Keli...W&M had it on line now

Ingrid_Doweary: That is interesting, Alt.

keli1: I think it will compliment the Black Law book, which I ordered really art, wow, right in line with the WPA recordings

Spivey: Hi jhonora!

jhonora: Afternoon!

Ingrid_Doweary: Hey Jhonora.

keli1: I have been following Angela's blog while she attends the Five Tribes Story Conference, it has been really good Hi Jhonora

Ingrid_Doweary: Yes, Keli1, it's amazing isn't it.

keli1: Selma, hmm online, I could of saved a few bucks

Selma: I was asking if it was online?

Ingrid_Doweary: Good looking out Jhonora on the Back Water Town, LA project, AY mention in her podcast.

jhonora: Thanks, Ingrid.

keli1: oh that thought you said it was online, I am not sure, it is 194 pages so really not that big

daviss: not sure vkn. I think she took NadaSue took a break from Genealogy

vkn: JHonora I need your help on a project with the surname Vincendiere that was the family in the Washington Post story. Slave holding Family from France Haiti Maryland and Louisiana

keli1: it was originally published in 191 and released in 2009, I thought that was kind of interesting

jhonora: Sure, vkn. C'est mon plaisir.

vkn: thanx daviss

Selma: I have it keli...

Ingrid_Doweary: Selma and Keli1, is this what you are speaking of?

Spivey: Oh, that means 'It's my pleasure' doesn't it johora?

Selma: W&M had a copy...I copied it was 5 cents a page at the time.. LOL

Spivey: sorry . . . jhonora.

jhonora: Yeah, spivey, just because we were talking about La. and Haiti

Spivey: Oh, I'm just happy I understood it jhonora. :)

Ingrid_Doweary: Oh yes, Vkn. I saw the articles about those historic sites.

keli1: no Ingrid but that looks interesting as well

vkn: Thanx a bunch jhonora I will need to phone avec you. email me the nombre @

Ingrid_Doweary: Okay, thank for clarifying, Keli1.

keli1: but the book is listed in their references, it is the first one on the list

Selma: Think it was probably his dissertation keli

Spivey: Welcome back David.

Ingrid_Doweary: WB David.

vkn: WB David I thought your exit was abrupt

keli1: interesting you say dissertation one of the references which I am trying to locate is St. G. Tucker, A Dissertation on Slavery, ed. 1803

alt: These 21 narratives are from springfield, Ohio .. I knew Mr & Mrs. Hawkins, Mr. Winburn & Mr. Emmons

Selma: Not at uva?

David: I typed a msg and hit the exit button instead of the send button! Sorry!

vkn: one ouchie pad and a dap of glue for you david lol

keli1: looks like Russell's records are at the Virginia State Library adn VHS


keli1: Art, thanks I love reading them..

alt: Mr. Winburn was the first licensed "official" AA undertaker in Ohio.

Ingrid_Doweary: 1 or 2 handshakes for historic personalities, eh Alt?

David: Someone mentioned Nell Irvin Painter on Book TV, so I dialed up the webcast and am now listening in the background. After that, I will listen to Adele Logan Alexander (I have her book, "Ambiguous Lives, Free Women of Color in Rural Georgia")

alt: yes Ingrid_Doweary, scary putting myself next to someone who was a "for real slave".

Ingrid_Doweary: Hey, appreciate the journey, Alt. David thanks for the heads up. I love to watch BookTV.

vkn: Yes David I was intersted that Logan Alexander had a new book out. I too have the Ambiguous Lives one

keli1: I mentioned her, watched her last night

David: Ingrid, I am refering to the video archived on

keli1: well actually early hours this morning

Ingrid_Doweary: Okay, thanks again David.

vkn: Spivey it makes good background reading for Middle Georgia research

Spivey: Which book vkn?

David: keli I love all of Painter's books, but I had never heard her speak -- the way she smacks her lips after every sentence is very distracting!

Selma: LOL

vkn: ambigious lives spivey

Spivey: Okay. Thanks vkn.

keli1: lol, I did notice that, smh I have never read any of her books, but liked what I heard

vkn: elocution lacking lol

keli1: lol and hello deannie

deannie: afternoon everyone.....

jhonora: Hello deannie

Spivey: vkn, question. Is Jenkins County considered to be in 'Middle Georgia'?

alt: hi deannie

vkn: deannie howdy doody

Ingrid_Doweary: Hey deannie

Spivey: Hi deannie!

vkn: Spivey ahem map map map lol

David: You notice Painter complains that the library where she is speaking is very hot, but she never removes the heavy shawl she is wearing. I think this is because she in some way regards nherself as an intellectual reincarnation of Sojourner truth. Her bio of Truth is beautifully-written and magnificent in every way.

Spivey: :( 8)

alt: deannie, a memebr of our gen group who works at the UGRR FHC in Cincy had a group from Chicago touring the museum .. they're looking for a 'genealogy home'.. she referred them to your AAHGS group.

daviss: hello deannie!

jhonora: "Genealogy home," good one alt.

Selma: Got to run folks...have a great day

keli1: Selma, yes the Dissertation on Slavery was from a W & M professor

Ingrid_Doweary: wb Dave

Spivey: Welcome back David.

vkn: velcro for david

deannie: We where in Ft Wayne two week ago....but I do know about the group that went to the museum......

keli1: deannie are you in FT wayne?

David: Just got bumped off the internet again. Nell Irving Painter also is an avid knitter, just like Sojourner Truth, a comparison she makes explicit in her book.

alt: gonna split y'all.. great session today.. take care.

keli1: bye Art,t hanks for your help

vkn: The AfriGeneas poet is also named Sojourner and likes to dress as the original

keli1: David do you think cspan will reair the book fest, or just catch it online?

deannie: On the ride back Nettie asked anyone if the wanted to go to FGS convention in Springfield in 2011....we will have a bus....I'm saving my money now......

jhonora: Our gen. society is planning to commemorate Rodolphe Lucien Desdunes next year. In 1911, he published the earliest history of colored New Orleans "Our People and Our History." Sadly, went blind the next year.

vkn: oh dear sorry to hear about loss of sight jhonora

Spivey: That's a sad story jhonora. Was that his only published text?

David: keli, I don't k now, but I plan to watch the parts i am interested in online

daviss: Have a good day everyone!! Thanks vkn for your support on my blog

jhonora: Yes. He wrote regularly for the Crusader, the paper behind the Plessy v. Ferguson cause. He also published poetry, although his brother was more a poet.

vkn: yassum

Spivey: Bye daviss.

daviss: bye

deannie: My co worker is going to New Orleans for the nun that's going to be a Saint

vkn: deannie who is that

jhonora: Really, she's coming on the 20th Nov.

deannie: My co worker is MissD when she's in the chat room yes

jhonora: I'll be there.

vkn: I meant who is to be made Saint jhonora deannie

jhonora: Henriette Delille, foundress of the Sisters of the Holy Family

vkn: ahhhhhhhh

deannie: Yes

Ingrid_Doweary: Happy to learn of the occasion.

vkn: Must have many good works

jhonora: We're hoping soon, she's just "venerable" now.

keli1: I located that book from B&N, the Disseration on Slavery published in 1796, yahoo

Ingrid_Doweary: Her wiki bio is very interesting.

Spivey: Please explain what you mean jhonora. She's just 'venerable' now and you're hoping for what soon? Is she going to be anointed into sainthood?

keli1: it all sounds exciting

vkn: jhonora I was about to ask how long has she been venerable

jhonora: Yes, spivey, but there are stages toward canonization. Servant of god, Venerable, Blessed, Saint. She's been venerable since earlier this year.

Spivey: Thank you jhonora. Is her next anointing to be Blessed then?

jhonora: Some of her relatives come when there's a gathering. Some have discovered they were colored, as their families were passing.

Spivey: How interesting.

vkn: uh oh

Spivey: :)

keli1: it is interesting and sounds well deserved

jhonora: Spivey, we don't know yet. It depends upon whether there is a declared miracle. Then she will be beatified. 'Anointing' is not part of it.

Spivey: Okay. I didn't know the correct terminology jhonora. I apologize. I'm Baptist myself and know little about Catholic rituals.

jhonora: Don't apologize. I wasn't upset. I teach catechism so I spend a lot of time getting 'em to use correct terms. lol

Spivey: So during the stages to sainthood, there have to be some miracles occuring which are attributable to her? And, thanks for understanding.

jhonora: Yeah, one confirmed miracle for beatification (second to last step) and another for canonization (last step).

Spivey: Wow.

jhonora: They did some serious genealogy on her. Wish I was kin, I have a lot to work with. vkn, are you desc. from a Vincindiere slave or just interested?

vkn: Just working a special project on descends of Vincendiere Just working a special project on descends of Vincendiere slaves jhonora Fillifill in particular

jhonora: Wonderful! What is that name Fillifill?

keli1: Vkn are they French-Vincendiere

vkn: who was age 35 when family left Maryland Will welcome the help of all to find descends keli1 yes

jhonora: Did they pronounce that Phil-a-phil or something close?

deannie: Ask MissD she has a lot on her I have her email address

vkn: Not sure jhonora I was suppossing that it was a form of some word for female deannie on Vincendiere ?

jhonora: Oh!! I was thinking that was a man's name. Yeah, you're right probably for "girl" or a pet name for some other name.

vkn: I think the surname became Vinson or vincent

jhonora: Fascinating. Van-sawn. I'm looking forward to hearing more.

David: Goodbye all!

vkn: Great discussion in here today!!!!!!!!

Spivey: Yes indeed vkn.

Ingrid_Doweary: Indeed!!!!

keli1: it is sounds interesting yes VKN, we did a lot of work on a missing family earlier, it was great input, etc

vkn: I be loving it and y'all

keli1: me too...this is the spot to learn and share

Ingrid_Doweary: Ditto!!!

keli1: Ingrid, I have been mulling thru the 1870 census, my bad eyes are rolling

Ingrid_Doweary: An enjoyable educational process, Indeed!! :}

Spivey: vkn are your plans for giving AfriGeneas more of an upfront face bearing out? Is that why I see someone new just about every time I come into chat now?

jhonora: 1870 census images can be very light.

Ingrid_Doweary: Give your eyes a nice break, Keli! Return to reading about an hour or t later. Oh check out the microfilm copies, also.

vkn: hmmmmmm

Spivey: :)

keli1: I did the microfilm last year at the local history center and no luck, using online is easier on the eyes, lol, I can blow up the text

vkn: Have a good rest of the day to all. My blackeyed peas are on the ready!

Ingrid_Doweary: You were unable to zoom in on the microfilm text?

keli1: I think typically the challenge would be finding folks in th e 1860 and earlier census, but I have the challenge of finding them in 1870s.

Spivey: Black eyed peas? Now, I'm hungry. Bye for now everyone.

jhonora: See y'all. Bye.

keli1: sound good..

Ingrid_Doweary: BYE Deannie what's new in ChiTown?

deannie: OHHHH the mayor....Daley's retiring and the race is on

keli1: I am signing off as well, I really need to do some school work and take the noted break as suggested, lol

Ingrid_Doweary: Take it easy, Keli1. So Deannie, do you think Rahm Emmanuel will run?

deannie: I do not even know who that is.....Meeks is thinking about running

Ingrid_Doweary: Who else beside Carol Moseley Braun is running? Rahm's Pres. Obama's Chief of Staff.

deannie: I have not heard his name mentioned

Ingrid_Doweary: Rahm Emanuel, former 5th District IL Hse of Rep.

deannie: Nope I have know heard Jackson

Ingrid_Doweary: The news outlets talking about him leaving the WH post to consider running for Chicago mayor. NEws outlets here in Wash., DC. I would like another White House Chief of Staff, but I don't see Rahm Emanuel as a Chicago Mayor.

deannie: OK....there's a Hispainc gentleman running...I do not know his name

Ingrid_Doweary: What's the coverage in Chicago regarding the mayorial race?

deannie: Trying to found a mayor...everyone is putting in their hats in....people are coming out of the wood work

Ingrid_Doweary: I bet they are. It's funny, this past Tues. evening, 3 of us who grew up in Chicago were together in the same chat room.

deannie: what was the topic

Ingrid_Doweary: Don't remember the broad topic, but we were commenting on Edadams's IL state history website on Cole County, IL.

deannie: Ok

Ingrid_Doweary: and African Americans. Here's the link, Well been here 3 hrs. Laters.

deannie: Have a great day

keli1: hey I am leaving out as well, Ingrid, let, you too

18 Dec 2002 :: 1 Feb 2009
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AfriGeneas ~ African Ancestored Genealogy