*LunchBunch

Start: 12:11:31
End: 13:29:21
Chatters: alt, AYWalton, daviss, fierybug08, HistoryBuff, Selma, Seventies Soulchild, vicjorob, vkn

daviss: well howdy there vkn!

alt: Hi ladies & Good Friday to ya

daviss: Hi alt!!

vkn: Howdy to you mz daviss and brother alt

daviss: same to you partner alt

alt: want some snow? we're getting a liitle

vkn: Did y'all listen to blog radio last night?

alt: I missed it vkn

daviss: nawwww lol we have enough of a chill here as it is lol lol

vkn: oops bring a note alt

daviss: no, I also missed it vkn. I had my head in the DC's trying to find folks

alt: yes ma'am ... Anita had a honey-do..... that needed to be done LOL

vkn: It was well done but crowd was down to 12 Honey Do comes first lol

alt: and i know it!!!!! Lol

daviss: does that also include the ones that did not come inside to the room

vkn: Not that familiar with protocols daviss so I cannot say

alt: daviss, got your email on Cleveland help.. will send you some links that might be of help on death records, burials, etc,

daviss: I dont think I came in on the first blog radio that I listened to vkn until I learned how to get into the room ok thanks alt. trying to help lady in my group

alt: hope we can help daviss.

daviss: me too alt!

vkn: Well I sign in via facebook and comment back to FB

fierybug08: hello everyone...*virtual wave* to daviss alt VKN

alt: is y'all African-Americans, Black or what?

daviss: well if it isn't fierybug08!!! hello there

fierybug08: lol

alt: Hi fierybug08 *virtual wave* back atcha LOL

fierybug08: *face palm* I'm in school right now...so I am anti-social

vkn: fierybug08 howdy you been missing

fierybug08: I miss you all VERY much.

daviss: I think thats what I did the next time vkn whats been up with you fiery?

fierybug08: I found out that my family is having a family reunion in May-- Louisville, MS

vkn: fierybug08 and we LOVE you too lol

fierybug08: and I found another surname... Orsby? Does that sound familiar?

daviss: Oh wow fierybug08, are you gonna go

alt: hmmnnn ,, never heard of Louisville MS.... Alabama, Ohio & Kentucky, but not MS.

fierybug08: I am hoping and praying. If I do...then I will probably skip Summer school

vkn: vicjorob hope you are keeping company with better health

daviss: hello vicjorob!!

alt: hello vicjorob

vicjorob: Hello everyone WB fierybug

daviss: mabe it wil be the holiday weekend fierybug and you may not have to miss school

fierybug08: yep...Louisville, MS. Mother's Day weekend too. Hi vicjorob

vkn: alt there is a louisville everywhere

alt: Selma's post on Goings & the UGRR had some intersting twist to it for me..... very interesting.

fierybug08: Yep...there is an Atlanta, Texas

Seventies Soulchild: Good afternoon lunchbunchers.

fierybug08: hi Seventies Soulchild

alt: I guess vkn... like Springfield is everywhere.

fierybug08: Columbus...Columbia

vkn: Howdy Seventies Soulchild

alt: Hello Seventies Soulchild

Seventies Soulchild: hey alt, daviss, fierybug08, vicjorob and vkn

daviss: hi there Seventies Soulchild

vicjorob: Hi 70s

fierybug08: Could you imagine if we could only use one name once? Pretty crazy huh? If I see another Main Street, I'm going to go nuts. lol

vkn: alt great Goings exchange with Selma.

Seventies Soulchild: lol fierybug08. But if you get on one in every city you will never get lost.

daviss: I am scratching my head on Atlanta Texas... trying to figure out why it seems familar

vkn: Unless you are in Detroit Seventies.

fierybug08: well...its near Texarkana...North East Texas

daviss: oh ok thanx fierybug08...Is it near Hooks what have you found out about Ornsby fierybug?

fierybug08: nope not yet

daviss: sounds like a odd name so hopefully you will be very lucky

fierybug08: I'm trying to contact the organizers now

vkn: Who is the celeb for the WDYTYA this evening?

AYWalton: Good afternoon, all.

alt: Hello AYWalton

daviss: Hi there AYWalton

AYWalton: howdy alt, daviss, fierybug08, SoulChile, vicjorob. Greetings, vkn!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

fierybug08: hi AYWalton

vicjorob: vkn - Marissa Tomeii

vkn: Hey Hey Hey AYW ey ey ey

AYWalton: hope all is well down in GA, vkn!

daviss: How's it going AyWalton!!

vkn: all is well mostly ayw

AYWalton: ah yes, WDYTYA is on tonight. I hope it is better than last week's which was a big flat.

vkn: vicjorob claim to fame fot Marissa ?

daviss: lol so everyone says

vicjorob: vkn -- she played the girl friend in My Cousin Vinny in the movie

vkn: ok thankee vicjorob

vicjorob: She won an Oscar for her role of the New Joisey girl who knew so much about cars

alt: and I think that's all I know her for vicjorob

vkn: thankee

alt: course I'm not much of a movie fan.

vicjorob: She was in a bunch of movies in the early 90s, including one with Robert Downey Jr (Chaplin), The Wrestler, etc.

daviss: and the next Fri it should be Blair Underwood

AYWalton: I will be watching it next week from St. Louis

Seventies Soulchild: back.... :}

AYWalton: I don't think I have ever watched Maria Tormei in anything, although I have heard her name.

alt: AYWalton, found Ennis Champ Warrick .. Rick Barrett's grandfather's grandfather in the 1850 census with his slave owner... Ennis Champ.. how bout that for a naming convention?

Seventies Soulchild: Marisa Tomeii played in "A Different world" I believe for 2 seasons.

AYWalton: wow how about that!! That is quite interesting!

daviss: oh really seventies

vkn: What is the event in StLoMo ayw and will you see Richard Schaffer?

Seventies Soulchild: yes daviss I believe the 2nd season of the show

AYWalton: I am speaking at the St. Louis African American Genealogical Society Conference, vkn.

vkn: Howdy HistoryBuff

AYWalton: I am excited for the trip, as I will also be given a tour of some historic cemeteries.

HistoryBuff: Hey Alt, AYWalton, Daviss, Fierybug08, Seventies, VicJoRob and Vkn.

daviss: How was the Blog Radio show last night AYWalton.. I am sorry I missed it

AYWalton: I asked about seeing the gravesite of Dred Scott and Harriet Scott.

daviss: Hello HistoryBuff

Seventies Soulchild: Hey HistoryBuff and hey AYWalton

AYWalton: about 10 of us will be doing some historic cemetery tours on Friday.

vkn: Terrific AYW

HistoryBuff: Oh that's wonderful to hear AYWalton. I'm excited for you.

AYWalton: it was interesting, daviss. I will be giving the Keynote and also two presentations. Bernice Bennett will also be there.

daviss: watch out for ants AYWalton lol

vkn: Waaaaayyyy to go AYW

AYWalton: lol

HistoryBuff: :}

AYWalton: Will do t hat, daviss!!!

daviss: lol

AYWalton: and then Friday evening I will be a guest on Geneabloggers radio program. Will do that from my hotel room.

Seventies Soulchild:

AYWalton: do it will be a busy weekend.

vicjorob: Congrats AYW!

daviss: You will be very busy but rewarding

AYWalton: yes, and I am looking forward to it.

HistoryBuff: See AYWalton. I told you that you are a lady on the move. :}

alt: hope the St. Louis weather is better than last year for you AYWalton

AYWalton: gee thanks HistoryBuff, but sometimes I prefer to just slow down and rest! I hope so too, alt.

HistoryBuff: Of course.

daviss: Is RS in St. Louis.. I wonder if he will attend

AYWalton: If he is aware of it.

HistoryBuff: Will that be next Friday in St. Louis, AY?

AYWalton: the 18th-Saturday. I have the information on my podcast! Today's podcast is already uploaded.

vicjorob: Have a meeting. Gotta go. You all have a good weekend.

AYWalton: africanrootspodcast.com later vicjorob

alt: someone yesterday mentioned wax museum's.. they have a great one in St. Louis.

HistoryBuff: Okay I'll be on the look out. Next thursday evening will be an exciting for me also. Cya VicJorob. Thanks AY.

AYWalton: I have not seen Richard Shaeffer, of late, has he been around?

daviss: come to think of it, I have not seen him in chat

HistoryBuff: That is RCS isn't it?

daviss: Hope he is well

AYWalton: hey Mizz Selma!!!!

Seventies Soulchild: Hey Selma

alt: I've seen a couple postings by him on FB in the past week or so.

daviss: yes HistoryBuff

HistoryBuff: Hey Selma, good to see you.

Selma: Good friday afternoon everyone...

daviss: Hello Selma!!

alt: Hi Ms. Selma

AYWalton: It would be neat for him to come to the conference. This is their 3rd Annual Conference. They are truly a group on the move.

Selma: Maybe someone could send him and email and check and see if he plans to come

AYWalton: I think he is on FB, I shall send him a message there.

alt: about ho many folks do they have in their group (memebrship)? any idea?

Selma: Just read your post alt...interesting how these threads intertwine

alt: ho=how

daviss: ok AYWalton

AYWalton: They have well over 100. When I spoke there before over 100 came and some joined that day.

alt: Yes Selma... the places. locations & time periods all match up. that's a nice sizes goup!!!! 100+

daviss: wow thats a nice group AYWalton!

Selma: Sure is a good sizie group AY

AYWalton: I will take photos and blog about the experience. If possible I might make a video from the events.

alt: now that is multi-tasking.... presenting, photos & vidoes LOL

Seventies Soulchild: ok lunch time is over. AYWalton have a good time in St. Louis.

AYWalton: well I won't be filming myself lol only others! Lol

Selma: Are we chatting tonite

AYWalton: yes we will be, Selma.

vkn: howdy selma

AYWalton: hope you will join us.

HistoryBuff: One of my cousins, a fellow researcher is coming to the DC area for business. We're having dinner on Thursday to plan a genealogy session for the upcoming Cummings Family Reunion in Chicago this August.

Selma: Yes, I will be here

HistoryBuff: Even if I'm not able to join the chat, I will be watching the program.

alt: best wishes with the planning HistoryBuff

AYWalton: that sounds like fun with the cousin, HistoryBuff

daviss: genealogy session... now that should be a goodie

vkn: much best planning HistoryBuff

HistoryBuff: It will be. Started the discuss last October.

daviss: I better run folks. Tyler's school lets out early today

AYWalton: later daviss

HistoryBuff: Cya Daviss

daviss: have a great rest of the day

HistoryBuff: My plan is make the session interactive and an applied learning experience.

AYWalton: I was reading an odd article where a genealogist was judging (and not so favorably) Herman Gutman's book, "The Black Family in Slavery and Freedom."

Selma: vkn..when I posted on the Genealogy Forum yesterday, my posting did not show immediately, am I doing something wrong..it has happened before

HistoryBuff: What the author's issue, AY?

Selma: Where was that AY

AYWalton: It was on a blog. Have to find the link.

vkn: i saw that selma

AYWalton: will send it described a "weakness" of Gutman's research.

alt: AYWalton, the kinda 'irks' me .. folks knocking the work of Gutman & others that was done 40-50-60 years ago with 'today's" information availibity and technology.. same with Woodson's census work done in the 1920's.

HistoryBuff: Where did you read the article, AYWalton? I would like to read it also.

AYWalton: I can email it.

Selma: Gutman's book made me appreciate footnotes and bibliographies..he sent me places I would not have gone

vkn: gutman is the guy ayw most reliable work but as you know all research has questions

alt: yes Selma... those works need to be 'appreciated' for their everlasting value and not compared to today's capabilities.

AYWalton: I think that as genealogists we have to remember that we are researchers, and we know how to find records but that does not make us historians.

HistoryBuff: Okay. I find it interesting also. I've recently searching for articles written by Dr. Woodson, stating the need for Black history research and recognition.

Selma: I look to them for the "context" in which I research these folks..

HistoryBuff: Okay, but historians also research and analyze history and it documentation.

alt: there you go Selma!!!

Selma: I don't always agree with their conclusions

AYWalton: historical context is important.

vkn: historians tell a story but not the whole story

HistoryBuff: I could appreciate that Selma. After it's that that individual's perspective.

alt: it was Gutman who blew the whistle on the same slave master/slave surnaming practices years and years ago.

AYWalton: quite true.

HistoryBuff: Oh tha's probably the basis for some contention.

AYWalton: they provide the historical landscape. We as family historians sort out the details on that landscape. wb Selma. need a seat belt?

HistoryBuff: wb Selma Okay. So it still is possible to serve as a genealogist and historian?

alt: and the King Carter, Samuel Gist, John Randolph manumission's prove his point.... thousands of slave freed by those 3 men and very, very few took those surnames. as just 3 examples is the 'crtique' on the Examiner AYWalton?

AYWalton: I would assume, but with the years of training to be an historian and the skill set in historical research and analysis, including statistical analysis of carefully collected data, I yield to historians to be called such. I call myself a genealogist. no alt

alt: okay AYWalton, thanks

HistoryBuff: I comprehend your point, AYWalton. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

AYWalton: I think that sometimes because we work with historic records, we use the term historian, but the research, Lit Review and data analysis to prove a single thesis sets historians in a different category. but that's just my opinion.

HistoryBuff: I'm on the same page with you, now. Point well taken.

alt: yep, John Hope Franklin was an Historian... we be's genealogist's interested in family history for example

AYWalton: quite true.

HistoryBuff: I appreciate how you put the distinction into context.

Selma: The discussion using Gutman is probably part of a larger discussion of "professonial genealogists" who feel that their efforts are not as well appreciated in the professional field Interesting that it is focused on Gutman..

AYWalton: I think it is because so many of us use Gutman and mention his work.

alt: I wonder if Ira Berlin fits into the author's category with gutman?

Selma: Actually I have read any number of books..where I have questioned conclusions they have made, because it was not supported by the records I saw..

HistoryBuff: You know I keep harping on improving upon a venue that fundamentally a good purpose. As usual you all have made excellents points.

Selma: The common assumption that the earliest free blacks were the children of white men..in fact from Heinnegs work we now know that they were children of white women

AYWalton: I agree, with that Selma, and of course one can find data to support one's thesis. But at least the data should be presented in a format based on one's analysis. that's true.

HistoryBuff: Good question, Alt. Sometimes Berlin has misquoted primary sources.

AYWalton: and Heinegg's info was based on data collected.

Selma: To be sure the majority of Mulatto children were the childrern of white men..but they were not making a family they were making a labor pool

HistoryBuff: That's the significant distinction-primary records.

AYWalton: the distinction was status and class. Mulatto children mostly fathered by white males, whereas mulatto free people mostly birthed by white females.

alt: also the point of Mr. Heniegg's work is mostly pre-1800.

AYWalton: But the assumption is that black = slave and therefore mulatto = slave = white father. (if that makes sense) When did the practice of indentured servitude deminish? I would assume that also added to a change in the planation culture.

alt: it does to me AYWalton and then when you throw in the NA mixture you get another picture.

AYWalton: the period of time that Berlin calls Phase 3 of slavery.

Selma: Yes alt..it was pre 1800..but it lays the foundation for the "free" non white populaiton

AYWalton: maybe slightly alt. I don't think it was that widespread, since so many NA communities had been exposed to European culture and European genes entered NA communities from the 1500s onward. Hunters, traders, furreirs etc. furreirs =furriers

alt: I know Selma... and the argument against Paul is based on post-1820 situations.

AYWalton: true

Selma: I don't understand?

alt: Pual points out the early mixing of black men/white women.. later arguments are 'plantation based and deal with the notion of white men/black woman. Pual=Paul

Selma: I still don't understand..

AYWalton: what Selma?

Selma: The plantation based white men and black women was going in the 1600's and 1700's..but these children were not FREE

alt: and Pual also gets into the free/indenture/slave combinations whereas most others are only dealing with slave situations. I know that too Selma many of my ancestors of products of that scenario.

Selma: So you mean his focus has "only" been on that combination

alt: no, the focus of others has been white men/black women.

Selma: Ok folks..have to run, have to continue this discussion another time

alt: will do, I hope LOL

HistoryBuff: Cya Selma

Selma: Hopefully will see you all this evening

alt: well, guess it's that time '' y'all take care.

HistoryBuff: If my home wifi works at that time. I'll be there. Cya Alt.

alt: bye

vkn: okies

HistoryBuff: Until later, Vkn. goodbye.

vkn: Great