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2011-12-26 After Xmas • BASS research

*LunchBunch

Start: 12:14:52
End: 13:51:36
Chatters: alt, AYWalton, bearnut2, Daviss, Khathu, Selma, Seventies Soulchild

Daviss: Hello Mr lucky alt!

alt: hi Daviss, Happy post-christmas day

Daviss: Thank you sir, and the same to ya

alt: what goes around comes around LOL LOL

Daviss: lol lol you know I thought about you\ I told my daughter, art and I should have made a wager lol

alt: told ya the Bengals would bite ;) hope you nad the family had an enjoyable christmas day

Daviss: our 3rd quarter comeback was just not enough :( well daughter is spending it with a terrible cold

alt: nope. just that () close

Daviss: but the kids are happy

alt: oh my, not a good time for a cold.

Daviss: I know, she went out after work on Friday to do the last min shopping and came home harking and coughing

alt: discovered a couple of marriage records in Pennsylvania on this last family search update.

Daviss: just that quick!

alt: WOW, that's a fast bug.

Daviss: I imagimne with all those people out there carrying their germs Did you know they were in Penn?

alt: I knew my mother maried her 2nd husband in Penn and the time period, but family search had an image of the actual record .... whoopie!!!

Daviss: whoopie

alt: and I knew of others who I thought had married in Penn.. found a couple of records confirming those mariages.

Daviss: I was on Family yesterday but had no luck they have death records for Texas but not indexed so you have to go one by one I started with the 1977 book

alt: oh my, that's a bummer.

Daviss: I know and you know not in any order lol they have 1977,78 and 79

alt: and on AfriGeneas someone posted a link to Sampson AFB basic training rosters in the 1950's ... found some fellas there, including my step-brother..... whose father was a son of my mother's 2nd husband.

Daviss: yes, I saw that posting alt!!

alt: it is amazing what is out there on-line, that we don't even have a clue about.

Daviss: that was a great find for that fella and for you as well

alt: welcome Selma, happ post-christmas day... you survived LOL

Selma: Good Monday day after Xmas alt and daviss

Daviss: This was the first time that fella had seen what his dad looked like wasn't it alt?

Selma: Just barely..I am about 10 minutes away from taking a nap

Daviss: Hello and Happy Day after Selma!

alt: oh, oh they wore ya out, huh?

Selma: Yes..they did, son, daughter in law, grand daughter and sister in law just left...I have the little darlins here with me..

alt: haven't had enough, huh? LOL

Selma: My grandson is here playing Pac Man...who knew that was still hot..apparently like Michael Jordan's sneakers

Daviss: oh oh

alt: they're keeping you 'current' with the market.

Daviss: how old ois grandson sel

Selma: 6

Daviss: oops pacman is good lol

alt: that's a tough age to keep busy....they're so full of energy at that age. as I remember LOL

Selma: He is happy with his Pac Man and Power Rangers

Daviss: oh yeah!! and power rangers are still in style

Selma: Yes they are..daviss

Daviss: and do you remember the little top soldiers? Tyler wanted those but they were all sold out

Selma: Member I said my grand daughter wanted the Dora the Explorer Lip Gloss..

alt: yep

Selma: Well apparently I got Lip balm which she said wasn't the same.. LOL

Seventies Soulchild: Hi alt Daviss and Selma!

Daviss: The guy at the store told daughter they might have them on the nest truck that came in..They were gobbled up also

Selma: She is 3

alt: Oops. grandma 'goofed up' LOL

Daviss: lol @ Selma

Seventies Soulchild: I said hey y'all...

alt: Hello Seventies Soulchild ... Happy day after

Selma: I told her it looked like lip gloss to me...she has decided it is OK.. LOL

Daviss: Hi Seventies..happy Kwanza

Seventies Soulchild: Selma why are you making fun of your grandbaby? lol

Selma: Hi seventies..Happy Kwanzaa

Seventies Soulchild: Hey thanks Habari Gani?

Selma: Seventies...I decided long time ago that in this life you needed a sense of humor or all was lost

Seventies Soulchild: You all will never guess where I'm at.

Selma: On vacation?

Daviss: I hope you got rid of your cold and are now at the Archives

alt: yu're so wise to be such a 'younger' person Seventies Soulchild LOL LOL LOL

Selma: National ARchiv

Seventies Soulchild: Yes sort of, on the Mega bus! I love it.

Selma: BRB

Seventies Soulchild: Free outlets and free wifi on the bus and the best part is it only cost my 90 dollars for all three of us to come to Washington D.C.

Daviss: Thats nice Seventies

Seventies Soulchild: This bus is full too! lol

alt: WOW Seventies Soulchild, that's round trip????

Seventies Soulchild: Yes round trip alt. At this price I may be able to come out to Indiana for some of the conferences.

Daviss: so it a train or a real bus seventies

alt: come on out to God's country Seventies Soulchild

AYWalton: Good afternoon, all.

Seventies Soulchild: Hi AYWalton

alt: hello AYWalton.. G'Day to ya.

AYWalton: How is everyone today? Howy alt, Daviss, Ms. Selma, SoulChile?

Seventies Soulchild: I may have to consider that alt.

AYWalton: Hope you are all well.

Seventies Soulchild: doing good.

AYWalton: great.

Seventies Soulchild: What did you do for the holidays AYWalton?

AYWalton: Selma did the little darlins have a nice Christmas?

Daviss: Hello AYWalton.. I was wondering if you would be here. I saw someone in Maryland won the Big one and I thought it was you lol lol

alt: we survived AYWalton ... kids, grandkids & great-grandkids all stopping in for a moment off and on all day long ..... whew!!!

AYWalton: Cooked a lot, had a very nice Christmas dinner, and then visited with close friends and had a wonderful time at a Christmas party last night. Great day! I wish it was me, Daviss! lol

Selma: Afternoon AY.. Yep the little darlins had a great Xmas..

AYWalton: I am sure they did!! sounds like you had a full day, Alt!

Seventies Soulchild: I was listening to this piece on BBC this morning where they said most of the christmas sale items are considered junk... I lol lol lol

alt: it was AYWalton, but truly a blessed day.

Seventies Soulchild: Couldn't believe they put it out there. :}

Selma: Sounds like it alt

Daviss: oh really Seventies

Seventies Soulchild: yes. I was glad I didn't buy anything yet. We're getting a Blackberry playbook They are $199 right now.

AYWalton: lots of Christmas things are junk. Those gift sets you see at stores, and tons of things that people buy because they are expected to. It can get insane. I don't get into all of that crazy spending like that.

Daviss: ok what is a playbook

Seventies Soulchild: A tablet, think IPad

AYWalton: and I never do that Black Friday shopping and all. I refrain from as much of the commercial aspect as possible. what is the playbook? Is it a tablet? I saw someone with a Samsung Galaxy. It was so cute---the small 7 inch was a great size!

Seventies Soulchild: Yes a tablet. Android apps

Selma: Well you are no help for the economy AY

AYWalton: I am still looking around and will take my time.

Seventies Soulchild: Playbook is the same size. I like it because it will sync up with my new blackberry curve phone and we can get online with it anywhere.

AYWalton: True Selma, I did as little as possible to stimulate the economy. that sounds nice, SoulChile.

Seventies Soulchild: My brother sold me on it. He had one from work

Khathu: Habari gani?

alt: but I don't want to be in sync LOL LOL LOL

Seventies Soulchild: Umoja!

AYWalton: Greetings, Khathu! good to see you.

alt: Hello Khathu

Khathu: Umajo, Habari gani

Daviss: hello Khathu

Khathu: Hello everyone

Seventies Soulchild: lol ok alt, we'll leave you with your desktop micro computer then... lol

alt: ready for Thurs. Khathu?

Khathu: i just responded to the toot post about the slave owner dying after 1865

Selma: Afternoon Khathu

Khathu: I think I am

AYWalton: where was the post, khathu?

Khathu: on the slave forum

alt: I did also Khathu. I'll have to check out your 'words".

AYWalton: oh that's right, khathus returns to the program.

Khathu: for round two

Seventies Soulchild: That was a good question. I would think that toot would be able to locate something even if the suspected owner died just after the CW

Khathu: AYWalton, I will be presenting at BAAHGA on January 7

AYWalton: what is baagha?

Daviss: I need to check the post khathu

AYWalton: you mean the Baltimore AAHGS?

Khathu: Yes, I put the wrong initials

AYWalton: I will have to attend if you are coming up! that is great!

Seventies Soulchild: You all seem like you have a very good group going there.

Khathu: toot, will probably have to do more research on the slave holding family during slavery to obtain the information

alt: there are a lot of published 'abstract' books of wills, deeds, etc. by local genealogy & historical societies ...toot might do well by checking for those types of materials in her research counties.

Seventies Soulchild: my boys are knocked out... lol

AYWalton: khathu will you present also on slavery research?

Daviss: Sometimes a will can be filed late also

Khathu: Yes, it is the same presentation I presented at the Central Maryland Chapter

AYWalton: great!

alt: she might look to Picton Press, Heritage Books, etc.

Selma: You have to be careful with some of those abstracts, not all details are abstracted..could just say "slaves" however document will lists names..

AYWalton: you did a good job then!

Selma: Usually slaves are not the focus of the abstract

Khathu: She might have to focus on how and when the slave holding family acquired the enslaved property

alt: right Selma.. but the abstract will lead to a volume & page number where you can request the full record.

Selma: Agreed alt...

Khathu: which will require her to learn more about the genealogy of the family

Daviss: I am interested in the how to's also

Selma: Or like I say..everything you ever wanted to know or not know about the slave owning family and then some

AYWalton: where was toot's post?

Khathu: also most wills do not list all of the enslaved property

Seventies Soulchild: is reading Khathu's response now.

alt: me too.. haven't done too much slave research.

Khathu: slave era research is really about researching the slave holding family and the enslaved ancestor(s) hello bearnut2

AYWalton: Greetings, bearnut2

Seventies Soulchild: hey bearnut!

AYWalton: Hope you had a nice holiday!

Selma: Afternoon bearnut..

alt: right Khathu, would one have to go to the 'appraisment of the estate' following death of the person writing the will?

Daviss: Hello bearnut2...cuzz

bearnut2: Hey Khathu AYWalton Seventies Soulchild Selma Cuz'n alt and cuz'n Daviss :)

alt: Hello bearnut2

Selma: If you are lucky the slave owning family fights over the estate..then you really get details..however not so luck for the enslaved property

Khathu: They would want to explain all of the probate records

AYWalton: bearnut2, I have been meaning to ask you more about your Emmanuel Bass. Where did he live?

bearnut2: I had a great holiday! I hope everyone else did as well !

Selma: Yes..I did bearnut

AYWalton: yes, I had a very nice Christmas!

bearnut2: AYWalton He lived in Rutherford county TN

AYWalton: You know---we need to talk. Did your Emmanuel Bass serve in the Civil War?

bearnut2: I've got an Emmanuel and a Ben Bass but I'm kinda thinking they may be one and the same...

AYWalton: were they in the Civil War do you know?

bearnut2: I'm not sure if thats my Emmanuel--there were a couple of them in TN

Daviss: The one owner of my Coopers/Whites was still alive after emancipation also. I am trying to find a will of his father but there were several Joe Whites

AYWalton: I know.

bearnut2: I'd probably have to see the pension record in order to know for sure

AYWalton: What census years do you have Emmanuel documented?

Khathu: Daviss, I would examine them all. Do you know the names of any of the siblings? If so, that will help you identify the correct one

Daviss: I just know Joseph and his children so far Khathu

bearnut2: Thats the thing--I only have Emmanuel in one census record 1870 and then I have a marriage record where he married Nancy Vaughter

Seventies Soulchild: The cooper/white line was in Mississippi, right Daviss?

AYWalton: you don't konw when he died?

alt: Khathu, you do also recommend looking at Census Slave Schedules, property & tax records as well as probate records right?

Daviss: no Seventies, Texas

bearnut2: But on all of the census records after that, Nancy was listed with Ben Bass rather than Emmanuel Let me check...

Khathu: correct

Seventies Soulchild: ok

Daviss: Grimes County

Khathu: in addition, to learning as much about the slave holding family as possible...echoing what Selma stated

alt: I think it is important for folk to not look at specific records in 'isolation' of others. but in combination of records over a period of time.

Khathu: I know more about the Whitaker Family than the descendants. They now contact me with questions

alt: not look at specific

Selma: LOL

AYWalton: bearnut2 how did you happen to zoom in on Emmanuel Bass in particular?

alt: I'm sure they do Khathu

Seventies Soulchild: :} How much do you charge per question?

Daviss: brb

bearnut2: the last census record I found him in is 1920 he was 79 yrs old

Khathu: alt - it is the analysis of several records combined that will provide the information

Seventies Soulchild: Gotta run. Speak to you D.C. folks later tonight.

bearnut2: AYWalton he is the husband of my 2nd great grand aunt

alt: I tried to use that approach in the story I related to 'toot' in my response to her question.

Khathu: with slave era research

Selma: Have a safe trip seventies

AYWalton: I see.

alt: and have fun Seventies Soulchild

Khathu: ttyl Seventies

bearnut2: have a good day Seventies

AYWalton: that's right you are traveling, SoulChile.

bearnut2: how did you wind up looking at Emmanuel Bass AYWalton ?

AYWalton: My gr. gr. uncle, Sephus Bass had a son called Emanuel Bass. They served in the Union Army together.

bearnut2: wow so have you seen the pension record?

AYWalton: Sephus enlisted with his brother Braxton, and with his two sons, Henry and Emmanuel. I have Sephu's pension. I don't think Emmanuel filed one.

alt: bearnut2, sounds like you and AYWalton, if not related directly may be related to 'cousins who married cousins' LOL

AYWalton: you never, know, alt.

alt: same location (TN), same time period (CW), same surname (BASS).... lot of sameness there

AYWalton: True. There were lots of folks called Bass though in that area.

bearnut2: yeah that definitely true--there were a LOT of Bass'

AYWalton: My Bass clan came out of Giles County, but by the early 20th century some were in Rutherford County, and then later moved to Kansas.

bearnut2: Hmmm--I know there were also Bass' in Wilson county

AYWalton: they are scattered in 1870. oh yes, and a huge contingent of Bass's in NC, but I have no tie to them that I know of.

Selma: Folks I gotta run...have a great "day after" Xmas day

AYWalton: you too, Selma

bearnut2: Maybe we are "plantation cousins" lol

alt: I know about the sameness thing, but you have a lot of information which will/may prove they are NOT of the same Bass family which is also important in your family history.

AYWalton: estate associates, we could say. I don't know where Emanuel went after the war. Nor Henry either, or if he survived. no pensions on them, that I can tell.

bearnut2: Ahh...I was hoping that might contain an answer

alt: it is as important to find out who is not related as it is related, keeps you on the right path with these 'common' surnames.

bearnut2: good point cuz'n alt

AYWalton: But revisiting those files is always a good idea.

alt: always

Daviss: keeping fingers crossed for your Bass connect

AYWalton: I will go through Uncle Sephus's file, soon. you never know.

bearnut2: For my Ben/Emmanuel I'm wondering if Emmanuel was the name given by his owner and Ben was the name he gave himself...He named one of his son's Ben Jr. but no Emmanuel

AYWalton: bearnut in the 1870 census there is an Emmanuel and there is a Ben, so in that household they were not the same person.

bearnut2: but compounding the problem is that there is a Ben AND Emmanuel listed together on the 1870 census! UGH!

AYWalton: how do you know that your Emmanuel called himself Ben?

bearnut2: I don't for sure but there is a marriage record for Emmanuel marrying Nancy Vawter and no record for Ben marrying and all the census records after the marriage have Nancy and Ben. I'm not completely sure but have been going on the assumption that Emmanuel and Ben could be the same person

AYWalton: they were close in age and could have been close brothers. I don't know if that is the assumption to make that they were the same. and siblings have in many cases married the same spouse.(of course not at the same time)

bearnut2: I'll find out soon if it is correct hopefully when I have another descendant take a dna test

alt: Khathu, have you done anything lately with your folks in Clay Co, IN?

AYWalton: my gr. grandfather Louis Mitchell Bass married Susan Houston. When she died he married her younger sister Georgia Ann Houston. and sometimes we look at things through our own filter.

Khathu: I have been trying to track down living descendants

Daviss: AYWalton did your Houstons come to AZ

AYWalton: meaning that we think of a "junior" as the child of the senior.

bearnut2: Yeah I have a situation where a man married two sisters--one after the other died

AYWalton: and a jr. being a son of a male. But I have seen 19th century female jrs. Mary Jr. Tempy Jr, Hattie Jr.

bearnut2: yeah me too-- recently in fact

alt: I still have contacts in Greencastle, Brazil & Terre Haute... shoot me some surnames and I'll see what I mcan drum up for ya.

AYWalton: and it is possible that Ben Jr. could be the son of Emmanuel who may have named a son, after his close brother Ben. not saying that happened but it was possible.

bearnut2: The thing is, Emmanuel never appeared in any census after 1870 so Ben Jr is the son of Ben Bass

AYWalton: Daviss the Houston name died with the women married into the Bass line. and the Bass clan is in AZ for sure.

bearnut2: I just have to figure out if Ben Bass and Emmanuel Bass are the same person

AYWalton: and in the household that is possible.

alt: hello Nadasue.. welcome

Daviss: I used to live two doors down from a Houston Family

AYWalton: is that right? where were they from, Daviss?

Khathu: have a great day everyone

AYWalton: you too, khathu

Daviss: But, I think they were from Tx though

AYWalton: oops he's gone. you never know, Daviss.

alt: 6 degrees of separation.... it's a 'blip' LOL LOL

AYWalton: lol

Daviss: hmmm where is Nadasue alt

bearnut2: lol

AYWalton: well I had better run as well, folks. Have a wonderful day everyone.

bearnut2: you too AYWalton

Daviss: later

alt: dunno, I saw where where she entered the room

bearnut2: i heard her but never saw her

Daviss: mabe she was bumped when khathu left

alt: I say .. hang with your Bass theory until something better comes up bearnut2 there are always all types of possibilities, but you seem to be on pretty solid ground.

Daviss: I just wish I could figure out counties, mabe I would be further along in my research

bearnut2: Yeah, it took me awhile to accept that they could possibly be the same person--I kept hunting for Emmanuel for years--I just recently decided that there was a good chance they were the same what do you mean Daviss?

Daviss: looking at census records you see states but no counties

alt: Daviss, you mean which county came from which county, or which county is a State folk may have come from?

bearnut2: All of the census records I've seen have counties...

alt: there is a great county map site linked on my TP home page Daviss ... take a look at that one. and it shows county development within the State by Census year.

Daviss: ok

alt: I think it is genealogy101

bearnut2: where are you looking at census records cuz? Maybe I can look too...

alt: my website Maps - Family History 101

Daviss: That is basically all my peeps in the census

alt: in the Links box on the right side of the page

bearnut2: lol I meant my OTHER cuz! ;)

Daviss: lol lol lol

bearnut2: lol couldn't resist that one!

alt: okay cousin of my cousin LOL

bearnut2: you did tell him Daviss?

Daviss: yep, you know I did

alt: :p to the tow of ya LOL LOL two

Daviss: unless he had a sip of whiskey he should remember lol

bearnut2: ok, Daviss , where are you looking at census records? Ancestry, Familysearch, ??? back atcha cuz! :P

Daviss: lol I use Ancestry and HQ bearnut2

bearnut2: ok--so when you look at the actual record on Ancestry the county should be right below the state in the left hand corner

Daviss: what I mean is that if I find someone who said they were born in Tn but the census is Tx, I have no idea where in Tn

bearnut2: Ohhhh--- ok! Now I get it! Yeah, thats true...

Daviss: so besides stuck on counties in other states I am also stuck on maiden names as well

alt: I try to look at the census records for the state they were born in and isolate the surname to suspect counties Daviss

bearnut2: I use death records and marriage records for maiden names

alt: during the periods in question

Daviss: try Davis in Tn alt and there are a zillion or NC

bearnut2: especially death records if some knowledgeable family member was the informant Do you know the slaveowners Daviss

Daviss: Only for one bearnut2

bearnut2: You may have to trace them back to see where/if they lived in TN

alt: you can also use the historical census browser foind on the LVA site to help locate "pockets' of AA's by county and state for each census year and then zoom in on surnames.

bearnut2: whats LVA?

Daviss: LVA site?

bearnut2: lol

alt: LIbrary of Virginia

bearnut2: ah thanks

Daviss: ok thanks alt

alt: do a google on Historical census browser

Daviss: ok will do

bearnut2: already on it ! :)

Daviss: hehehehe I am afraid to get bumped right now

alt: it's specualtion but an icrease/decreas in numbers of AA's between census years may be indicative of some mass movement of folks.

bearnut2: ooh thats a cool site cuz!

Daviss: alt do you have peeps in Indy also

alt: example in 1850 for Miami county OH there was an icrease of almost 600 blacks from the 1840 census... in 1846 almost 400 fromere slaves of John randolph moved into that county accounting for most of that increase. bunches of IN folks and in Indianapolis too.. my father's people came to IN in the 1880's from NC.

Daviss: Looking for Tolberts

alt: oh wow... like the tolbert's who played BB for IU...

Daviss: found joseph in 1870 and 1880 in Texas

alt: not sure, but I think many of the Indiana Tolbert's came from NC... around the Edgecombe county area in NC

Daviss: He was on the Texas Votor Rolls in 1868

alt: hey y'all I gotta run... good chat today, take care.

Daviss: ok alt

bearnut2: bye alt guess I'll sign off too... later cuz'n Daviss

Daviss: ok later


18 Dec 2002 :: 1 Feb 2009
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