2011-08-02 Hawkins & Stanley research
3rdthawkins: hey Selma
Selma: Evening 3rd Looks like folks are late..or sleep
3rdthawkins: yeah, looks like it lookin' over my grma's employment records, trying to glean anything from it about her and my grandfather, good info it gives, wish I could get my grandfather's employment records. there has to be a reason why I'm not able to get his
Khathu: good evening 3rd and Selma
3rdthawkins: hey Khathu, early this week :}
Selma: Where did she work that you got her employment records Evening Khathu
3rdthawkins: D.C. for the government hey vkn
Selma: Evening vkn
vkn: Good evening daviss has computer probs
Selma: Sorry to hear that
3rdthawkins: sorry to hear that, hope she able to get in or get that fixed
Khathu: good evening vkn
vkn: and backatcha Khathu I was reading the Sunday chat log. So interesting about FBI as source
3rdthawkins: Khathu, you live in D.C., right?
Selma: Yes, it was interesting vkn
Khathu: Yes, I do.
3rdthawkins: Cool, you know I moved to Virginia last month after the tornado in Missouri
Khathu: No I did not know that. What part of VA are you residing in?
3rdthawkins: Stafford, south of Quantico
vkn: Seraph said that she was in Roanoke VA this Summer
3rdthawkins: yeah, it gives me a chance to do some research here for my grandparents in the D.C. area
AYWalton: good evening, all. hope everyone is well.
Khathu: Good evening AYWalton
3rdthawkins: Khathu, I do need some help in knowing where to go to do research for my grandparents in this area, D.C. mainly, libraries, courthouse, etc.
Khathu: Question: What would be the motivation of someone changing their first in which was Roach in 1900
vkn: So Selma who is the keynoter for Ft Wayne?
Selma: Don't know vkn
3rdthawkins: they didn't like it is one Khathu
AYWalton: Jim Isom is giving the keynote.
Khathu: Well 3rd - there is the National Archives, Library of Congress, DC Archives
Selma: You mean their first name Khathu?
Khathu: D.A.R. Library
3rdthawkins: anything for the years 1945-1991 Khathu?
Khathu: Yes, their first name
Selma: The church they attended 3rd?
Khathu: I would check out those places first
3rdthawkins: ok Khahtu
Khathu: including the DC Library
3rdthawkins: hey Sadonya
Sadonya: Hello 3rdthawkins AYWalton Khathu
vkn: Hey Cuzzie Sadonya
Sadonya: vkn hey cuzzie we need to talk when should I call
3rdthawkins: Khathu, religious reasons, didn't like it, want a more professional or adult sounding name....
vkn: anytime. After the meeting tonite is fine
Selma: Had the person moved to another place, when they changed their name
Khathu: no they stayed in the same place and went by R. M. Stanley or R. Matthew Stanley
3rdthawkins: I have several of that in my family...........my grandmother's sister changed her's from Doris to Judith, my aunt changed her's, my great great grandmother's sister changed her's, or at least used Rosa instead of Magdalene
vkn: Oops forgot to send you the analytics file ayw will do so later this PM
Khathu: before dropping the initial R altogether
Selma: Maybe kids teased hem about the name when he was younger..
3rdthawkins: not sure about that time Khathu, but I know kids may have made fun of his name
Khathu: i agree
AYWalton: ahhh ok, thanks vkn.
Selma: Was it a family name, was he named for someone?
3rdthawkins: I'm trying to see when he was born, if it was a slave name, or was he born after slavery
3rdthawkins: who Khathu is talking about
vkn: Y'all be good!
Khathu: Selma not that I am aware of. He was born in 1878
3rdthawkins: oh, ok, hmm
Khathu: he may have been named after someone. who i do not know.
Selma: Just wondered, thought maybe he just didn't like it, but waited until the person passed before he stopped using
Khathu: I am writing an article proving the identity of this individual who went by Roach Whitaker, R. M. Stanley, R. Matthew Stanley and finally Matthew Stanley
3rdthawkins: what was the surname change for, I wonder
Khathu: I am proving that this is the same person His parents were not married
3rdthawkins: ahh, ok, identity issues can come into play also.....I don't know, just thinking/saying
Khathu: I have only been able to locate one record where he is listed as Roach Whitaker
AYWalton: going to run folks. Sorry to be brief. Have a good one!
Khathu: i have the documentation to prove it is the same person
3rdthawkins: that is cool Khathu, so you can prove it
Khathu: i am showing how i came to the conclusion based on the research it is my great grandfather
3rdthawkins: but also, what about oral history? what does family call him? who do they refer him as?
Khathu: Mathis or Matthew but his sons remember letters being addressed to him as R. M. Stanley and his daughter remember that his first name was Roach. In addition, his older children recalled him having a brother named Jack Whitaker who lived in Millerton Oklahoma
3rdthawkins: that is good info I know it's not written proof, but you do have evidence of family referring to him by that/those name(s)
Khathu: In addition, Uncle Jack named his son William Stanley Whitaker after Roach's fathert the oral history combined with the documentation is what proves my case
3rdthawkins: yep, that is good
Selma: Sounds like you have a good case
Khathu: based on Genealogical Proof Standard I will share the article will you all once I have finished writing it up with my source citations
Selma: Great would like to read
Khathu: I am planning on submitting it to NGS
Selma: Ahh..for the Journal
3rdthawkins: I have to do that for my great grandmother, who's name is not on her birth certificate, but state the reason why I believe it is her('s) same thing for her older sister
Khathu: At the very least they will provide me with feedback even if they do not publish it
3rdthawkins: especially since the mother's maiden name is wrong, different, but even with that, I can explain.
Selma: Folks have to run..have a good evening
Khathu: I'm out as well. Good night
3rdthawkins: slow nite
Sadonya: yep did you get my email?
3rdthawkins: no, i Have to go check it
3rdthawkins: I need to give you my other email, I rarely check the one you have, so will email you the one I check daily
Sadonya: okay thanks
Sadonya: where did you grow up?
3rdthawkins: grew up in D.C. and in OKlahoma
Sadonya: were you a military brat?
3rdthawkins: no, didn't have a father, mom was a single parent just trying to make it and raise her children
Sadonya: I understand I did the same thing where in OK did you live
Sadonya: really how nice Tulsa has a rich history
3rdthawkins: yeah it does
Sadonya: my ex use to live there pastored a church there
3rdthawkins: my brother went to school there, he found an apartment for us to live in, mom wanted to get away from the crime in D.C., so we moved to Tulsa
Sadonya: oh I see
3rdthawkins: it was a nice place to grow up in
Sadonya: so brother is a lot older than you are wonderful
Sadonya: what brought you to Tennessee
3rdthawkins: my little bro was going to school, so mom and i moved closer to him, it helped him out a lot
Sadonya: where did he go to school
Sadonya: oh okay where does your Mom live now
3rdthawkins: we're in VA
Sadonya: okay so your Mom is a Hawkins or was that your dad
3rdthawkins: no, she never married my dad
Sadonya: how many kids did she have
3rdthawkins: 8, all boys
Sadonya: wow so where do you fall in the stack how many older and how many younger
3rdthawkins: 7th :} just one younger
Sadonya: next to the youngest so thats why you are spoiled lol
3rdthawkins: lol u know it
Sadonya: so how did you like Tennessee when you were here
3rdthawkins: it was cool, nice place,
Sadonya: my daughter lives in Nashville
3rdthawkins: wish we got to do a lot more in the Music City
Sadonya: again how old are you? lol
Sadonya: you are he age of my oldest son I have a daughter 33 and one 38
3rdthawkins: son the youngest?
Sadonya: the one that is 26 2 sons both youngest
3rdthawkins: oh, ok
Sadonya: I found a birth record for a Thomas Sanders but not the year yours was born I really wish I could find more records on my Thomas on the Sanders in SC were in both Charleston and Sumter
3rdthawkins: yeah, I know what you mean and how you feel, would like to know more about my Sanders family before 1900
Sadonya: I found a Marcus Sanders in 1870 well all that is in the email I sent you
3rdthawkins: ok, probably have seen that one before, I have all the Marcus Sanders in a database theres two 39 years old, one black one mulatto, there's a 60 year old marcus sanders, etc.
Sadonya: I saw the 1880 census you referred too there was a Frank Sanders there also but it really does not explain the Thomas he was too young to work yep
3rdthawkins: yep, not sure who he would be, I don't have a Frank listed as a brother of my great great grandfather Thomas, but he does have a brother named Sumter
Sadonya: did you see the Thomas with a father named Marcus in 1870
3rdthawkins: it seems only two of his siblings lived past 1900 yes I did, I think mother is Elsie? or Harriet?
Sadonya: did you get Thomas death certificate?
3rdthawkins: yep, firstborn daughter/child was informant, she knew father's name but not mother's
Sadonya: yeah that was strange have you been to Charleston?
3rdthawkins: but my grgr grandfather was informant on his brother Richard's death certificate, and put mother's name, but put McCloud for maiden name......nope
Sadonya: did it have Marcus as father
3rdthawkins: hoping to go to a SC with a cousin of mine, but may not be able to go to Charleston, since she is only a Hawkins descendant, we will only be going on a Hawkins research trip
Sadonya: weren't they in Charleston also
3rdthawkins: yes Sadonya, Markis W. Sanders was how it was spelled, put, I wonder what the W. stands for, he was also Marcus W. Sanders on Thomas' marriage record,
Sadonya: I will look into that
3rdthawkins: from at least 1870 to 1881 when it was Charleston County, but it became Berkeley County in 1882, my great grandmother Ella Sanders born and raised in Charleston, but my great grandfather Charles Hawkins was born and raised in Berkeley County. They met in Berkeley (st. stephens) and married there, they lived back and forth in Berkeley and Charleston. Some of my grandfather's siblings I think born in Charleston, I know my grandfather was born in Berkeley
Sadonya: so what took your mom to DC
3rdthawkins: her first husband was from there, she was living in AZ when they met, she moved back and forth from D.C. to AZ, some of my older brothers were born in AZ, some in D.C. She finally moved to D.C. in 1975 for good after my brother who was born right before me was born in AZ then she met my father
Sadonya: are you saying you were born in DC or AZ? sorry confusing
3rdthawkins: I was born in D.C., my mother left AZ in 1975 before meeting my dad
Sadonya: oh okay got you you were born in 1979 or 1980?
Sadonya: what month?
Sadonya: My son was due to be born Dec 25, 1979 but came Nov 17
3rdthawkins: wow, early birth,
Sadonya: yes premie only weighed 4 lbs but look at him now
3rdthawkins: yeah, that's cool, I hear ya
Sadonya: so what is your Moms name?
3rdthawkins: I was born with medical problems myself, I believe stem from my grandparents being first cousins, not because they were first cousins, but since they were first cousins, it made their children and descendants more likely to inherit those family medical conditions She probably wouldn't like me to tell
Sadonya: okay Well actually marrying your first cousin does not cause medical problems only marrying your sib
3rdthawkins: not that it caused it, but blindness was already in the family, it just made their kids more susceptible to it
Sadonya: I have done a lot of research on that issue during Bible times and after cousins married all the time especially in England to keep the money in the family
3rdthawkins: I know, that's what i was talking to my mother about about Bible Times
Sadonya: Some how here in America we got that mixed up In Tennessee its in the law books that cousins can get married I did research on a white family that had cousins to marry
3rdthawkins: same in D.C., that's where my grandparents married. On their marriage license, it states both were first cousins
Sadonya: they were from GA
3rdthawkins: cousins can marry in D.C., that's where my grandparents married,
Sadonya: Your grandparents lived in DC also do you mean you fathers parents?
3rdthawkins: yes, my father's parents
Sadonya: got you
3rdthawkins: that's where my mom and dad met, D.C
Sadonya: yeah you told me how old were you when you moved to OK
Sadonya: so have you ever lived on your own or with Mom all your life?
3rdthawkins: with mom
Sadonya: You are a good son
Sadonya: I need to call VKN see you next week.. go look at that email and give me a response please
3rdthawkins: ok then, I will, nite